The Politics of Fear - Page 3 - Political Forum

presluc · 05-24-2007, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Think for myself

I think the next liberty infringed upon will be freedom of speech. Once the government has that, then whoever may be in power will be free to do as they wish. As it stood just a couple of years ago, anyone who was against the war was not a patriot.

I don't think the freedom of speach will ever be lost.
Americans are not stupid, that old phrase {if you don't agree with me you're unpatriotic} is just about over with.
Now people are starting to ask questions.

presluc · 05-24-2007, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by perdidochas

Shouldn't people have the right to say somebody's not a patriot, without the accusation that they are infringing on freedom of speech?

The right to freedom of speech only applies to the government. I don't recall the government prohibiting people talking against the war.

To accuse someone of something just on the basis they disagree with you is not good form in my opinion it is abuseing your right instead of useing it.
Just because you at times have disagreed with me should I say you are unpatriotic, I THINK NOT.
You are an American there for I can disagree with you and at the same time respect you.

baxter · 05-24-2007, 02:56 PM

Quote:

I don't feel any liberties infringement, except for the limitation of my right to bear arms (my employer doesn't allow it).

Unless you're a cop or in the military, why should you have the right to bring a gun to work?? Or anywhere for that matter. If you want to bring a gun to work, aren't you a victim of fear? I know that the 2nd Amendment permits it, but things change over time and with change must come updates in our laws.

perdidochas · 05-24-2007, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by presluc

To accuse someone of something just on the basis they disagree with you is not good form in my opinion it is abuseing your right instead of useing it.

I disagree. I have the right to express my opinion about you, as long as it's expressed as an opinion, and is not a lie.

Quote:

Originally Posted by presluc

Just because you at times have disagreed with me should I say you are unpatriotic, I THINK NOT.

If you think I'm unpatriotic, you should say so. I have no problem with that. I will probably tell you why you're wrong, but it's your right to tell me you think I'm not a patriot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by presluc

You are an American there for I can disagree with you and at the same time respect you.

If I think you're unpatriotic, and I feel stifled from expressing that, is that respecting you. Is that respecting freedom of speech? I don't think so.

perdidochas · 05-24-2007, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baxter

Unless you're a cop or in the military, why should you have the right to bring a gun to work?? Or anywhere for that matter.

It's called liberty. I should be allowed to do anything that doesn't directly harm others. My carrying a gun would harm no one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by baxter

If you want to bring a gun to work, aren't you a victim of fear?

No, I'm a victim of fear now. If I had a gun, I wouldn't be as afraid. (actually, I'm not afraid now, either, but I have had a job when I would have been much better off had I been able to carry a gun--the place I worked was in a neighborhood in which the local gang had an initiation requirement of committing a violent crime on a white man. They specialized in carjacking, and shot several white men, and killed at least one)

Quote:

Originally Posted by baxter

I know that the 2nd Amendment permits it, but things change over time and with change must come updates in our laws.

Fundamental liberties should never be lost.

FRYandBENDER · 05-24-2007, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baxter

Unless you're a cop or in the military, why should you have the right to bring a gun to work?? Or anywhere for that matter. If you want to bring a gun to work, aren't you a victim of fear? I know that the 2nd Amendment permits it, but things change over time and with change must come updates in our laws.

I always thought that carrying a gun kept you from becoming a victim?

baxter · 05-24-2007, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Fundamental liberties should never be lost.

This is going to sound a bit ridiculous but let me show you an example of a liberty that was lost for a good reason. At a time, the English people had the right to kill Scots with a bow & arrow on any day of the week except Sunday. The English have now lost that right. At the time of the loss of this right, people were probably saying just like you that fundamental rights should never be lost. But the relations evolved and things had to change. A "militia" is no longer essential for our security. We have ample police and military and all other types of security measures. It helps no one having civilians carrying weapons. The only thing it can do is cause trouble.

FRYandBENDER · 05-24-2007, 03:33 PM

If that were true then people who follow the law WRT guns would already be a big problem. The only people you would be taking guns from would be those who follow the law and only use their weapons for self defence. Why should those of us who have a healthy appreciation and respect for guns be punished because of the actions of those who will be able to get guns anyways?

FRYandBENDER · 05-24-2007, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baxter

After the Cold War and the fear of nuclear war with the Russians, comes the fear of terrorism and the Middle East. With all these different alert level colors and the Department of Homeland Security, these fears are used as weapons to reduce our civil liberties. Like the fact that there are hundreds of innocent detainees on Guantanamo bay imprisoned without trial for years, or starting a war in the Middle East. The government frightens the people into accepting these reforms.

What liberties infringement do you feel on a regular basis?

What is the next step?

The next fear?

The next reduction of civil liberties?

Your latest post is a far cry from your OP. First you say that the government is taking away our liberties through fear tactics and now your trying to "scare" us into thinking that unless we revoke our right to bear arms we are all in danger.

baxter · 05-24-2007, 03:49 PM

Quote:

If that were true then people who follow the law WRT guns would already be a big problem. The only people you would be taking guns from would be those who follow the law and only use their weapons for self defence. Why should those of us who have a healthy appreciation and respect for guns be punished because of the actions of those who will be able to get guns anyways?

Guns are used for killing things. Now, I'm not going to suggest getting rid of hunting, but for weapons that are used for killing other human beings, is there such thing as a "healthy appreciation"?

Now I also think that gun control laws should be followed up by cracking down on the guns black market, because otherwise, I agree, you're just taking the weapons away from the law abiding citizens and not from the criminals.

I'm not trying to scare you, but if you are scared, it is a perfectly sane fear, which can be confirmed by just looking at the number of people with weapons in the U.S and the number of gun related crimes.