Biggest story of our time: our self-extinction ? - Political Forum

Ygorl · 12-26-2006, 12:56 PM

Something to think about. Or dismiss as "hooey" like a typical secularist

Biggest story of our time: our self-extinction

December 24, 2006

BY MARK STEYN Sun-Times Columnist

Suppose for a moment that the birth in Bethlehem that Christians celebrate this week never happened --that it is, as the secularists would have it, mere mumbo jumbo, superstition, a myth. In other words, consider it not as an event but as a narrative.

"The world has collapsed," announces a BBC newsman in a new movie. "Only Britain soldiers on." Europe in 1940? No, 2027. Adapted from P.D. James' dystopian novel, "Children Of Men" is set on a planet in which humanity is barren. That's to say, it can no longer reproduce. And you'd be amazed at how much else collapses with the fertility rate.

You might have a hard time finding ''Children Of Men'' at your local multiplex. It's a more pertinent Christmas movie this holiday season than ''Bad Santa 3'' or ''The Santa Clause 8,'' but Universal seems to have got cold feet and all but killed the picture. In an enthusiastic review in Seattle Weekly, J. Hoberman observed: "Universal may have deemed 'Children' too grim for Christmas, but it is premised on a reverence for life that some might term religious".

Christmas is a good time not just for Christians to ponder the central proposition of their faith -- the baby in the manger -- but for post-Christian secularists to ponder the central proposition of theirs: that religion is a lot of goofy voodoo nonsense and that any truly rational person will give it the bum's rush. The problem with this view is that "rationalism" is looking less and less rational with each passing year. Here are three headlines from the last couple of weeks:

• • "Mohammed Overtakes George In List Of Most Popular Names" (Daily Telegraph, London)

• • "Japan's Population 'Set To Plummet' " (BBC News)

• • "Islam Thrives As Russia's Population Falls" (Toronto Star)

By comparison with America, those three societies are very secular. Indeed, Russia spent three-quarters of a century under the most militantly secularist regime of all: Under Communism, the state was itself a religion, but, alas, only an ersatz one, a present-tense chimera. As a result, Russians more or less gave up begetting: Slavs are in steep population decline, and, on present trends, Russia will be majority Muslim by 2050. And the Russian army will be majority Muslim by 2015. In western Europe, societal suicide isn't quite so advanced, but the symbolism is still poignant: "George" isn't just the name of America's reviled cowboy president, but of England's patron saint; the national flag is the Cross of St. George, under which Englishmen sallied forth to smite the Mohammedans in those long-ago Crusades. Now the Mohammedans have managed to smite the Georgians big time, not by conquest but simply by outbreeding. Mohammed is also the most popular boy's name in Brussels, Amsterdam and other Continental cities.

But forget Islam: In Europe, they're inheriting by default. There are no Muslims or any other significant group of immigrants in Japan and yet the Japanese are engaging in a remorseless auto-genocide. Already in net population decline and the most geriatric society on earth, their descent down the death spiral is only going to accelerate. As the BBC reported, "The imbalance is threatening future economic growth and raising fears over whether the government will be able to fund pensions. But Chief Cabinet Secretary Yasuhisa Shiozaki said: 'It's impossible for the pension system to collapse due to the declining birth rate because we will adjust the amount of money put into it.' "

Oh, OK then. But, just as a matter of interest, when you "adjust" the amount of money you put into the pension system, whose pockets are you going to "adjust" it out of?

The obligation to have children may be a lot of repressive theocratic hooey, but it's less irrational than the secular self-absorption of a barren Russia, Japan and Europe.

CHICAGO SUN-TIMES :: Mark Steyn :: Biggest story of our time: our self-extinction

emptypepsi · 12-26-2006, 07:04 PM

Just to make clear, who does the author refer to in "our self destruction" for the we? Non-muslims? I enjoyed reading it, just making clear I suppose.

In any case, I did a report on Japan's economy a couple of years ago and it seemed that most people were saving and saving but never spending. They were keeping in good health but not having many children.

It seems that the author is afraid of a change in the 75% majority (source: 2000 Census) of Americans being white. If the author wants a return or stability to a "White America", I must say it is silly to think we will achieve it with some kind of go-go reproduction race. Outbreeding "the others" them would be a Pyrrhic victory, and a kludge. We don’t want to let the country be overwhelmed by this. His best bet would be to push for lower immigration numbers into America, if I'm reading him correctly.

He reminds me a lot of Pat Buchanan.

george.d · 12-26-2006, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emptypepsi

Just to make clear, who does the author refer to in "our self destruction" for the we? Non-muslims? I enjoyed reading it, just making clear I suppose.

In any case, I did a report on Japan's economy a couple of years ago and it seemed that most people were saving and saving but never spending. They were keeping in good health but not having many children.

It seems that the author is afraid of a change in the 75% majority (source: 2000 Census) of Americans being white. If the author wants a return or stability to a "White America", I must say it is silly to think we will achieve it with some kind of go-go reproduction race. Outbreeding "the others" them would be a Pyrrhic victory, and a kludge. We don’t want to let the country be overwhelmed by this. His best bet would be to push for lower immigration numbers into America, if I'm reading him correctly.

He reminds me a lot of Pat Buchanan.

I think the eventual decline of Christianity (around 2050) as the dominant US belief system will have more of an impact on US societal aspects than just the 'White America' nostalgia.

Japan is facing an aging problem, as are other developed nations, but the high rate of personal savings will help defray government social costs. Unlike the US with negative personal savings and a looted SS Trust.

Brother Oz · 12-26-2006, 08:35 PM

WEB, Mohammedans is what we (the Christians) used to call Muslims, because they follow Mohammed, like we follow Christ, but this is offensive to Muslims because they don't think of Mohammed as divine, so we started calling them by the name they used for themselves.

Anyway, I've seen many similar articles to these before. They always talk about how the white race will be out-bred, but I just don't see why this matters. Is the world a better place if a higher percentage of Europeans are white? With global warming and good nutrition, being white is becoming less of an advantage and more of a disadvantage for people living in Europe. I'd rather have darker skin, then I would burn less easily. What's the problem? The way it is talked about makes it sound like white people will be killed off, this isn't what's happening. What's happening is a higher percentage of Europeans will be born with darker skin.

Brother Oz · 12-27-2006, 07:52 AM

Quote:

* Here complaining about population decline in Japan, when Japan is basically atheist (Shinto is a culture, IMO, not a religion). Her argument is based upon religion and she treats Japan as a religious country when it is not.

Well, I'd say Shinto was a religion, but no one really believes much in it anymore. Don't forget that Buddhism is also very big in Japan, the third largest political party is a Buddhist theocrat party. But that's not really the point.
Isn't the author saying that religious people have more kids, and Japan has less kids because it is atheist?

Izzibeth · 12-27-2006, 08:51 AM

Shinto is a religion in Japan. It falls under the category of "animistic" belief similar to the Native Americans where everything has a spirit. It is incorrect to say that not many people believe in Shinto. Together with Buddhism, it is the most popular religion in Japan. There are some who are Shintoist, Buddhist, and some who are both.

Religion isn't a major aspect of Japanese lives, however they do practice many of the major ceremonies connected with Shinto and Buddhism and parades and festivals are really pretty abundant. Christianity is low. I think it is somewhere around 2 million people are Christians in Japan (I believe that is a high estimate).

The Japanese are experiencing a population decline for many reasons, but one that I believe is most important is the change in women's roles. Women in ancient Japan used to be equal to or higher than men. Their main god (besides the two who created the Earth who are "husband" and "wife", Izanagi and Izanami) in Shinto is actually a goddess named Amaterasu, the Sun Goddess. However, with the rise of the samurai and the introduction of Confucianism, women became "lower class" citizens. Women became lower than men and lost many rights and privileges over time. Now, after WWII, that has all changed again. With women's rights movements making their way across the industrialized countries, Japanese women are taking advantage of their new freedoms. Many young women are not getting married, not leaving home, and not having children. They are working random jobs just to make enough money to buy luxuries and living with their parents. A large number of young women have said that they have no interest in getting married or having children. One reason for this is the men, who are not really used to this newfound Women's Rights Movement, are having a tough time changing their domineering ways.

Anyway, I could go on forever, but... that has been the main problem that I have seen. The young women simply do not want to date, get married, or have children. There have not been as many children born recently as there should be to maintain population and so.... as of this year their population, from what I understand, has capped and will begin to decline unless that trend stops. The Japanese government is attempting to work on this (offering and paying for speed-dating services for employees and whatnot) but, like WEB said... they are overpopulated and perhaps it's not such a bad thing that their population declines a bit. I'm sure it will pick up again when it needs to. The only problem is that there are too many 65+ and not enough young people to maintain the economy.

But.... yeah... Japan is mainly Shinto and Buddhist which are both major religions and practiced in Japan. There are Christians but not many at all.

Brother Oz · 12-27-2006, 09:29 AM

I think that's really the point, European birth rates are falling because women are better educated and a lot of them want a career rather than a family. Muslim immigrants don't have this as much, but I think that as they assimilate, Muslim women will want careers rather than families, and their birth rate will fall too.
This is the thing with these articles on demographics, they always work on current trends, "if the birth rate continues to fall at the current rate", but trends change.

Ygorl · 12-27-2006, 11:33 AM

Congrats to Oz

Seems he's the only one that was able to catch the meaning of this writing.

Well done man

........than the secular self-absorption of a barren Russia, Japan and Europe.

... becoming the same self absorption in the U.S.

That's all. Dismiss as hooey and malarkey if you like. That's what other upcoming cultures and peoples of Earth want. Our own self destruction over time. That we're too foolish to understand.

Maybe. Maybe we'll wake up.

Brother Oz · 12-27-2006, 12:05 PM

Yes I understand what the author means, but I don't think they know what they mean. Are we talking about the self-destruction of Western culture, or Christianity? The author seems unable to distinguish between the two.

Ygorl · 12-27-2006, 02:05 PM

That is the point of the article. We've done our best to get rid of any HINT of Christianity in our culture. That which BUILT our culture. Moving towards "progressive" or "secular" where we'll worship "knowlege" and be "enlightened" with "information" and "logic".

We no longer know what is right or what is wrong. It's "relative" to every person. Every person is his/her own separate free little "country" that they inhabit. We're no longer parts of America. We're parts of "the WORLD".

This is the lack of cohesion brought by progressive ideals that teach us that we must remove any and every sign of religious faith from our culture. We've seen and we're seeing the effects of this on OTHER cultures. We're seeing what happens with those that KEEP a religious faith as a solid part of their culture.

The author is "unable to distinguish between the two" because the two are part of a whole. That these parts are separating and problems are coming about BECAUSE of that separation is what this is about.

Another interesting point is the beginning where it is noted that: Universal seems to have got cold feet and all but killed the picture. "Universal may have deemed 'Children' too grim for Christmas, but it is premised on a reverence for life that some might term religious".

Yet another example of a reluctance to show even a scintilla of encouragement for anything religious or that might encourage one to even THINK about it.

A mass cultural suicide is what he's talking about. Which is easy to dismiss and laugh off while we're comfortable