Should health care precede religious belief... - Page 4 - Political Forum

Troianii · 11-07-2007, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

This family refused life-saving treatment because of their religious beliefs, resulting in the birth of two healthy babies and the death of their 22-year-old mother.

For me, this is a nonsense and a prime example that religion requires regulation by law, to ensure the rights of the individual are protected in the face of unreasonable outdated fanatacism.

Do posters feel the family were right to stand by their beliefs, or should medical assistance have been given irrespective?

I've actually heard similiar arguments that say all soldiers in the Army should be thrown in the locker for attempted suicide.

Viv · 11-07-2007, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oregon Elephant

I don't think she was right, but I think that you don't have the right to tell her what to do in that situation.

House was bashing some guy's religion while the guy was on his death bed with only hours to live. He was talking solice in his beliefs and accepting his fate believing that he would go to a better place, and House began ripping on it to his face. House eventually killed himself (for like 90 seconds) to see for himself if there was something on the other side. He never said whether he saw something or not, but the way the episode ended made it seem like he saw something.

And he will probably tell them that their mother passed away from a hemorage (or whatever it was) and that she is with God right now watching over them, (or something to that nature). There is no single place where all blame can be placed. If she allowed the BT, she'd have lived (part her fault), if he allowed it, she'd have lived (part his fault), if she never got pregnant, she'd have lived. If, if, if... there are hundreds of factors that lead up to the situation, maybe if she was in better health she would be fine. Maybe anything...

Yes. And if she'd had a blood transfusion, she would definitely have lived.

She should have been saved from herself, to argue about it another day.

Viv · 11-07-2007, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Troianii

I've actually heard similiar arguments that say all soldiers in the Army should be thrown in the locker for attempted suicide.

Do they have to attempt suicide first or....what on earth does that comment mean

iTaliAN_ICe · 11-07-2007, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

Yes. And if she'd had a blood transfusion, she would definitely have lived.

Why should life be forced upon those who don't want it? It isn't anyone's decision to make but hers. We may disagree with her choice, but should she be forced to do what we say just because we think it would be better for her?

Oregon Elephant · 11-07-2007, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iTaliAN_ICe

Why should life be forced upon those who don't want it? It isn't anyone's decision to make but hers. We may disagree with her choice, but should she be forced to do what we say just because we think it would be better for her?

When it comes to a person's actual life, I agree with you.

Troianii · 11-07-2007, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

Do they have to attempt suicide first or....what on earth does that comment mean

What you are saying is that their personal beleifs lead them to some form of "suicide", or at least in your own perspective. In "The Loneliness of the Long Distance Runner", the main character writes that (paraphrase, from memory) "anyone who joins up in the Bosh is in a hurry to get themselves killed, and they shoud all be thrown in the locker." Basically, people had personal values that led them to join up in the British Army in WWI, which by some perspective is suicide. I can't see how this is much different from what you've said.

Viv · 11-08-2007, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iTaliAN_ICe

Why should life be forced upon those who don't want it? It isn't anyone's decision to make but hers. We may disagree with her choice, but should she be forced to do what we say just because we think it would be better for her?

OK Ice, firstly I agree with civil liberties.
In my view, government should construct and enforce laws which protect the people under its care. Why is religion is excluded from this? If anyone else was saying...kill yourself, they'd be stopped. If you encouraged someone to jump off the bridge by telling and convincing them they can fly, you'd be arrested.
Law should prevent religion from encouraging people to act in a way which endangers life. If it did, the woman wouldn't believe in this stuff, it would be taken out of the picture.
Or is that too Big Brother?

FRYandBENDER · 11-08-2007, 04:54 PM

I forgot to respond to your last post to me Viv. Yeah, I was kidding, at least to a certain extent. While I do think it pretty rude to splat your guts and have someone else clean it up, that isn't really the point of what I was saying like I kind of made it out to be.

I do think people should be free to kill themselves though.

iTaliAN_ICe · 11-08-2007, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

OK Ice, firstly I agree with civil liberties.
In my view, government should construct and enforce laws which protect the people under its care.

I agree to an extent. Laws should exist to restrict behaviors and actions that harm others or the property of others, but not to protect people from themselves unless age, a mental handicap, or something else clouds their judgment.

I do agree that most drugs and suicide should stay illegal, but I don't see a problem with letting life take its natural course by refusing medical treatment.

The government should protect us to an extent, but in the end, only we can decide what's best for us individually.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

Why is religion is excluded from this? If anyone else was saying...kill yourself, they'd be stopped. If you encouraged someone to jump off the bridge by telling and convincing them they can fly, you'd be arrested.

I don't view this as suicide. The lady is dying through no fault of her own, and can choose to either postpone her death or allow it to come as it would have anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

Law should prevent religion from encouraging people to act in a way which endangers life. If it did, the woman wouldn't believe in this stuff, it would be taken out of the picture.

I don't think a government should be able to interfere with any legitimate religious beliefs its citizens may hold.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viv

Or is that too Big Brother?

Nah, I just don't agree with it.

billybones468 · 11-08-2007, 11:54 PM

Its sad but in the end i think its her choice. But then why isn't suicide legal