Political differences between US and EU - Political Forum

ThePryingDutchman · 04-20-2007, 12:11 PM

When I was browsing the forum, I noticed someone comparing the European and American party systems. Over here (and in many other European countries), the US 'crazy left-wing liberals' are actually on the right side of the spectrum. Left of them are the Christian Democrats, Labour parties, Socialists and in some countries the 'Green' parties (environmental left).

What do the Americans (and Europeans, of course) think about this difference? And don't you think your country would be better off if there were more political parties. I suppose there are many Americans who vote one of the two, just because there is no other choice (well actually there is, but that would mean wasting your vote, right?)?

In a system like the French (for instance), with multiple election rounds, the voter could probably vote closer to his/her allegiance.

Just curious

Slartibartfas · 04-20-2007, 01:10 PM

The political parties somewhat center around the political "average". Even in a two party system like the US is one.

A more party system has however the advantage that the range of opinions around this center gets more varied. The green party in Austria for example caused that the environmental issues, transformed from a nonissue to something one has to address, even in the conservative party. Believe it or not, but the conservatives lost so many votes to the Greens, especially in the capital, that they had to do something against it.

So more party systems lead to it that non centre aims of a minority might also find their way into the mainstream. In the US this works however also to some extend as there, the third party is simply abstaining from vote. If the parties ignore the non centre minorities completely they will loose to the non voters.

The difference between the parties in America and Europe, is therefore not too much the result of systems, but of the voters. Europeans simply have different political opinions than Americans. The American and the European mainstream are not the same. Thats all.

ThePryingDutchman · 04-20-2007, 01:18 PM

I didn't think what you said about the American third party is true. Americans must be aware of the fact that the third candidate never wins. So voting for that candidate will be one less for the democratic/republican candidate you favor over the other. I'd say the issues of the third party don't really matter.

Apart from that: If there would be, say, a large group of Americans that would vote for a Labour(ish) candidate, that would affect the entire spectrum there, but since the candidate doesn't exist, they vote democrat and nothing changes. I do think it makes a difference.

Brother Oz · 04-20-2007, 02:47 PM

They do have a Green party, which in effect is the left-wing party.
I agree, however, that the main reason is that Americans are simply more right-wing, so their "left-wing" is our "right of centre", and their "right of centre" is our "extreme right".

ThePryingDutchman · 04-20-2007, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neorealist234

more than 2 parties?

that wouldn't work for two reasons:

1. our businesses would have to spend even more lobbying money...a good corporation donates money to EVERY candidate, which hedges them in elections....more parties would mean more costs for businesses.

I dislike the thought of companies 'buying in' through elections, by the way. Over here, politicians can't take money from businesses, to make sure there's no conflict of interests.
But I suppose you were being sarcastic

Quote:

Originally Posted by neorealist234

2.Can Americans handle the complexity of multiple parties? parlimentary/congressional coalitions?

Brother Oz · 04-20-2007, 06:15 PM

Quote:

2.Can Americans handle the complexity of multiple parties? parlimentary/congressional coalitions?

Well, I'm certainly not sure many Americans are intelligent enough to be able to comprehend the existence of more than two political ideologies... well, plus the Unamerican parties, like the dirty Commies and Nazis.

But anyway, the way your political system works is similar to ours, in that you have a first past the post system, which tends to produce majorities. We have 10 parties in our parliament, but we've never had a coalition since the Government of National Unity during WW2 (where Churchill and the Tories ran the war, and Attlee and Labour ran the civil affairs of the country).

ThePryingDutchman · 04-21-2007, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neorealist234

the whole post was satirical noob.

I saw that. Mine wasn't.

And you did have a point, despite being funny as hell

Slartibartfas · 04-21-2007, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThePryingDutchman

I didn't think what you said about the American third party is true. Americans must be aware of the fact that the third candidate never wins. So voting for that candidate will be one less for the democratic/republican candidate you favor over the other. I'd say the issues of the third party don't really matter.

Apart from that: If there would be, say, a large group of Americans that would vote for a Labour(ish) candidate, that would affect the entire spectrum there, but since the candidate doesn't exist, they vote democrat and nothing changes. I do think it makes a difference.

You misunderstood me. I did not refer with "third party" to a real party. I referred to people who abstain from voting. Which means the large party he voted before looses votes, which is not as bad as loosing the vote to the other large party but, to be precise its half as bad.

They can no afford with the tough majority fights we see at each election to give away votes , they have to care for all votes they can get, and here the center clearly is not enough.

ThePryingDutchman · 04-21-2007, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slartibartfas

You misunderstood me. I did not refer with "third party" to a real party. I referred to people who abstain from voting. Which means the large party he voted before loses votes, which is not as bad as loosing the vote to the other large party but, to be precise its half as bad.

Then we agree

Interesting that, so far, all the replies not meant to showcase an incredible sense of humour have been from Europeans.

dahermit · 04-21-2007, 11:43 AM

Quote:

...the Unamerican parties, like the dirty Commies and Nazis.

What about the "clean" commies?