dahermit

With all due respect, I do not think that you have any reasoning to support your belief...or you would likely have stated it.
Regards,
dahermit

emptypepsi

I'm very suspicious on this topic. Some pidgeonhole me in as a Deist, as I could argue for a higher being, but not on a personal level. I believe a creator would have to be quite peripheral. I'm still very much an agnostic in a lot of ways. I've not seen very much to totally throw me into a cateogroy of a Deist or Pantheist, but I've never quite had the assurance that nothing is there. I don't think anyone has the answer. Until they do, I'm going to live my life and keep on pondering. It doesn't hurt to keep your mind open.

As for the OP, I get the feeling that panteth is right WRT having ones mind made up. It really is not anybody's job to convince you. Not one human can. The truth is to be found on ones own, IMO.

__________________
"The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom."
Isaac Asimov

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emptypepsi

On an issue where it's obviously pretty difficult to come up with objective evidence one way or ther other, I'm usually very skeptical when one party claims to have the definitive answer on the matter. It's always open for debate on BOTH ends, not just against those who have faith.

Perhaps in the whole 'believe to be safe' regard, people are simply using the thought of the creator's existence as motivation. That could be true. If so -what is wrong with that, so long as the ends of being motivated produce condusive results? It's not your life, why worry about it?

__________________
"The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom."
Isaac Asimov

http://www.politicsforumpoliticalwor...ion-forum-rule

dahermit

Merely asking for intelligent rationale.

dahermit

Because of the invasive nature of religion. Despite that fact that the existence of God is unprovable (an equal chance for or against) "...atheists should not be allowed to be citizens of the United States..."- Geo. W. Bush. ..."one nation, under God..." ...do you swear, so help you God..." etc., etc. Religion is not exactly benign when it comes to athiests.

Izzibeth

No, I didn't mean a "belief in God" per say. I just meant a belief system in general.
I don't believe in gods or supernatural powers... but I have beliefs and a belief system. If they are truly healthy then they will, at some point, doubt and analyze their beliefs.. but they will not forever. Eventually they will become comfortable in what they believe and no longer feel the need to doubt it. Even children, born and raised Roman Catholic for example (*raises hand*) will, as they grow older, hopefully doubt, analyze and then come to the conclusion that they either are strong in their faith and do believe in the Roman Catholic God, are wavering in their faith and are not sure if they believe in the Roman Catholic God (perhaps not being sure or perhaps moving on to another religion to find out if it's right for them), or have lost that faith and do not believe in the Roman Catholic God (or perhaps any other gods) (*raises hand again*). Blind faith is generally not healthy.

But as I said... beliefs (whatever they may be) are only really truly attained by the individual (as long as they are relatively healthy... more importantly mentally healthy... and mature, of course).

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Izzibeth

In the United States that is true. There are a number of other countries that are quite tolerant of atheism. But American atheists have to be careful which battles they choose to fight (especially in a country which is mostly religious... mostly Christian to be specific) because if not, then atheists come off as anti-religious instead of a-religious. And that doesn't help at all.

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emptypepsi

On an issue where one can neither prove nor disprove the existence, I think you're asking for a facet of the discussion where logic only goes so far. Believing definitley or not believing definitley are both matters of faith, when the fact is that neither can be proven. I don't think one can honestly 'know' anything more than the truth that one comes to individually. In regards to god, it's a truth that may be different for everybody, as there is no real way of knowing.

Rephrase the question slightly and see if you know where I'm coming from: prove to me definitively, beyond all doubt, that God does not exist.

__________________
"The saddest aspect of life right now is that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom."
Isaac Asimov

http://www.politicsforumpoliticalwor...ion-forum-rule

dahermit

I see where you are coming from. I am a rational person. I take in the evidence and make decisions based on the evidence. In the case of a supreme being there is an overwhelming lack of evidence of such. Therefore, as a rational human being, I conclude that most likely there is not a God. That is the point at which I am at. What I find disconcerting is that many people will admit that there is no evidence but none the less aggressively denounce people that take the opposite position.
Thanks for the input.
Regards,
dahermit

FRYandBENDER

First off let me say that 95% of your responses stink of thinly veiled condescension. Oh yeah, thats right, you're the super intelligent athiest. You have all the anwers and those who are foolish enough to believe in something other than themselves are mindless bobble heads for you to play with. First you start a thread saying "Convince me that there is a God" knowing full fucking well that it is pretty much impossible due to lack of any credible evidence. But hey, maybe you just need to hear other people's personal reasons for choosing to believe what they believe. Then when people give you their reasoning for why they, or perhaps others, believe this or that, you make snide fucking comments like you actually think that this board exists to prove you wrong. If you want convincing I'll give you a little tip. Don't "look for God" by asking others where you can find him, either look for him yourself or don't. Don't ask people what or why they think something, especially when it is as personal as their religion, and then act like their a mind-numbed retard. I think that most people have responded that they feel like they would be unable to convince you, not because they are unsure of why they think the way they do, but because you already have your mind made up.

Now for this pile of bull shit.
Poor baby, you have to buy things with money that has "in God we trust" written on it. What a fucking calamity of fate. Or, oh no, "one nation under God." What the hell do you even care for? Does this really wound you some how? Why don't you just be glad it doesn't say "a nation under one God." Then you would have something to bitch about.

Why don't you quote a fucking fish on religion while your at it. Everyone knows that this guy is bat shit crazy. Like he could even pull that shit off anyways. Way to worry about the right things buddy.

I can't believe you've gone through all of these posts responding in such a serious, albiet condescending, tone, and then you posted that shit. You could have kept it going for a little while longer couldn't you? Are you just disgruntled because your a white male and need a reason to feel persecuted? Do you need a hug? I really can't believe this is where you went with this thread. What a fucking waste.

__________________
Neither am I the means to any end others may wish to accomplish. I am not a tool for their use. I am not a servant of their needs. I am not a bandage for their wounds. I am not a sacrifice on their altars. ... I owe nothing to my brothers, nor do I gather debts from them. I ask no one to live for me, nor do I live for others. I covet no mans soul, nor is my soul theirs to covet.

Ayn Rand, Anthem.

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