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04-01-2008, 07:39 AM
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Mercenary
Libertarian-Leaning Liberal
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 308
Location: Oregon
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Do you think 90% of the world all suffer from some mass form of delusional hysteria because they believe in a God?
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Yes.
1. Religions come in various forms.
2. No single religion holds a majority of people.
3. If one religion is correct, the others must be partially or fully incorrect.
4. Therefore, a majority of religious people are delusional even if one religion is correct, but all of them may be delusional.
But it's understandable. It's pretty painful to think you and everybody you know will not exist after death. So it's a coping mechanism for many. I think I'd prefer eternal torture to non-existence. I'd prefer to believe in the supernatural even if I knew for certain I was damned, but I can't believe something simply because I want to. I believe things because they seem seem to fit experiment and reason.
From the 8 steps site:
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Only in a universe governed by God can universal, immaterial, unchanging laws exist. Only in a universe governed by God can rational thinking be possible. We use rational thinking to prove things. Therefore
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Non Sequitur, not that I fully agreed with the premises to begin with... The concept of God is actually contrary to rationality as far as I can tell. It relies on faith, which is the opposite of rationality. Why must a supernatural being exist for rationality to exist? A more reasonable explanation is that rational thought confers an evolutionary advantage to a species that is physically weak for its size, i.e. humans. (Not that rationality is completely limited to humans.)
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ARGUMENT FROM MULTIPLICITY (V)
(1) There exists a web page Hundreds of Proofs of God’s Existence
(This site is where a few of these quotes come from)
(2) That page has hundreds of purported proofs of the existence of God.
(3) They can't all be wrong.
(4) Therefore, God exists.
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And why can't they all be wrong? A googolplex of false statements wouldn't prove anything except that some number of people spent a lot of time coming up with ridiculous gibberish.
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COSMOLOGICAL ARGUMENT, a.k.a. FIRST CAUSE ARGUMENT (I)
(1) If I say something must have a cause, it has a cause.
(2) I say the universe must have a cause.
(3) Therefore, the universe has a cause.
(4) Therefore, God exists
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If the universe has a cause, there is no reason to assume that God is the cause of it. If anything, God complicates the equation more than what we've observed thus far of the natural world would suggest.
Lets not leave out the possibility that mankind cannot comprehend the beginning of the universe, if such an event even occurred, in much the same way that a dog cannot comprehend calculus. Does this prove there is a God? No, it certainly does not. It's actually kind of silly to make up an anthropomorphic explanation for the universe. We're pretty infinitesimal. Of course, some higher being who made us in his image designed it all? Right... It's arrogant to assume that we are of the level of intelligence to understand all things. Something might currently or forever be out of our cognitive reach. I'm not saying this should limit inquiry, but when there is not enough evidence to make a claim, why make it? Before we understood lightning people believed in deities like Thor, Odin, and Zeus. Maybe if we ever fully understand the universe, the more abstract Gods will die too.
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04-02-2008, 05:18 PM
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Conscript
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 34
Location: In a house...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chesty Puller
2: who can honestly say the world is not better having 90% of its people believing in God and following a moral set of guidelines which is laid out in almost every religion?
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I dunno, maybe cause we:
1: kill each other in the name of > insert deity here<?
2: live like ignorant rednecks and pollute the world in the belief that we're going to a better place soon?
3: let our loved ones die while we pray, instead of taking them to a certified doctor?
4: oppose some forms of science, 'cause we believe they are sins?
5: are delusional if we talk to things that doesn't exist?
6: aren't supposed to follow a set of rules, that is 2000 years old and with little relevance today?
As i said i've got no clue.... Pick one 
__________________
"Democracy has nothing to do with freedom. It's just an oppressors way of suppressing a minority..."
"Everyone's a pacifist between wars. It's like being a vegetarian between meals."
"Knowledge is knowing how to, Wisdom is knowing why."
"An open mind is like a castle, with its gates unbarred and guards asleep."
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04-04-2008, 02:03 AM
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Squire
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 162
Location: Joliet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hbloms
I dunno, maybe cause we:
1: kill each other in the name of >insert deity here<?
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People kill each other by thousands every day in the name of money, sex or drugs.....so I dont see your point here. You act as if without religion no one would ever be killed...lets be realistic here shall we?
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2: live like ignorant rednecks and pollute the world in the belief that we're going to a better place soon?
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Everyone in the world does this and you dont need to be religious for this broad generalization to apply to you I know plenty of Atheists who pollute so again I fail to grasp the logic of this argument , religious people are not solely responsible for pollution.[/quote]
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3: let our loved ones die while we pray, instead of taking them to a certified doctor?
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Your quoting from a known cult "Jehovah's witnesses and yes they are known for this type of stupidity which is why any true christian shuns them.
again a broad sweeping statement about all religions when in fact it applies to less then 1%.
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4: oppose some forms of science, 'cause we believe they are sins?
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Just as scientists oppose religion because they believe these is no proof or that the rest of us suffer from a lack of education on evolution? Again this so called example is meaningless.
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5: are delusional if we talk to things that doesn't exist?
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Kind of like how anyone who used to think the world was not flat was thought to be delusional or possessed? Through time, logic and investigation it was in fact proven the world was not flat. Again this argument fails to implement even the most basic amount of logic.
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6: aren't supposed to follow a set of rules, that is 2000 years old and with little relevance today?
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Religion is no more irrelevant then many scientific facts that were discovered by Newton, Magellan, DaVinci or Einstein hundreds of years ago?
As I said before this argument in my mind is ill thought out and comes across as nothing more then an attempt to derail a legitimate thread with meaningless drivel.
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As i said i've got no clue.... Pick one
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I couldn't have said it better myself
__________________
A politician thinks of the next election. A statesman, of the next generation.
- James Freeman Clarke
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04-04-2008, 02:10 AM
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Squire
B L Zeebub
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 176
Location: Greater Manchester
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I worship Mammon, or is it Mammories, I get mixed up, so I got my wife to have a tatoo of the Euro on her left breast, and £ on her right breast, so when I feel like sucking the "Tit" of capitalism I have a choice! but I am weak and greedy and I believe in equal rights so I take advantage of my "position" and suck both  Am I a sinner?
Last edited by George Berkely : 04-04-2008 at 02:11 AM.
Reason: I need to get abreast of the subject
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04-04-2008, 04:33 AM
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Squire
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 162
Location: Joliet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by George Berkely
I worship Mammon, or is it Mammories, I get mixed up, so I got my wife to have a tatoo of the Euro on her left breast, and £ on her right breast, so when I feel like sucking the "Tit" of capitalism I have a choice! but I am weak and greedy and I believe in equal rights so I take advantage of my "position" and suck both  Am I a sinner?
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You can not be sinning according to scripture if your having relations with your wife, thats more of a duty 
__________________
A politician thinks of the next election. A statesman, of the next generation.
- James Freeman Clarke
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04-04-2008, 07:25 AM
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Viscount
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,287
Location: Graz, Austria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nash
No invention of God, this come from deep studing of the earth that you arrive at the conclusion that their is a God, now if you use that to gain world power then sooner or later you will fall. Constintene took christianity for the reason of having more power and look at what happened in the end Rome fell..much later on.
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Considering the universe is...well, atleast extremely large if not even infinite, any conclusion you draw from solely "deep studying of the earth" is actually pretty worthless. That just for the technicalities, I do believe there is a God, but trying to proove it by rationale is pointless for it cannot be done. Same goes for the opposite.
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04-05-2008, 04:06 AM
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Squire
B L Zeebub
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 176
Location: Greater Manchester
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chesty Puller
You can not be sinning according to scripture if your having relations with your wife, thats more of a duty 
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Thank you, as a mammonoralologist I also indulge in the exploration of the precious metals spot markets,the gold or "G spot" is my fav, it bring great results if you know how to dip in and out of it with vigour, you have to be cunning  , as to duty I think you are being fallacious!
Last edited by George Berkely : 04-05-2008 at 04:12 AM.
Reason: pun
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04-05-2008, 09:26 AM
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Mercenary
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 274
Location: Cowal Peninsula
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Aztek
Yep.
We will only get an answer to that question when we die. There is no way of proving anything for or against the theory of God. (hope I don't get a helluve shock when I finally turn up my toes 
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04-05-2008, 01:33 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mairead
Aztek
Yep.
We will only get an answer to that question when we die. There is no way of proving anything for or against the theory of God. (hope I don't get a helluve shock when I finally turn up my toes 
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Even if god were to exist why would that indicate an afterlife? This is basically one illogical assumption built upon another illogical assumption which is built upon even a third illogical assumption.
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04-05-2008, 02:02 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 229
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I don't think there are many athiests, like myself, who would claim that there is no god. However, many of use believe that it is illogical to believe in something that has no positive proof, even if there is no negative proof. There could be a god, and since I don't know, I won't believe in it as a default.
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