Science vs. Scientism: Creation Science vs. Evolution - Page 2 - Political Forum

That Darn Republican · #11 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 02:24 PM

Was that the arguement, Argrippina? or was it don't use scripture if you don't know it or even more... don't worship the God that gave it for instruction. Even your quote doesn't support your reply. Have some coffee sweetie -- it'll do you a bit more good then some of the things you hold on to, but God does love all His creation and wants you to come to know Him. But was not the focus of the article nor the reply.

counterpointing · #12 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 02:36 PM

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Originally Posted by That Darn Republican

Tolerance is not, repeat... not a doctrine taught in the bible anywhere... just so you know. Abhorrent behavior need not be suffered by any just people they identify it and deal deal with it. .

This comment is a shame to your religion. It is a thing of vile intent and disgraceful, malevolent meaning with no care to intelligence or ethics whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by That Darn Republican

Remember, you may find this hard to believe but Christians aren't the problem with the world Agrippina - your feminist underpinnings are clouding your judgment. Secondly, on the subject of judgment, Yes we are implored not only as Christians, but as citizens to be judgmental of behavior of not befitting a decent citizen all in the natural context of the word..

No, not all Christians are a problem. Many are good people. Many are not. And your words fall into the latter category; when was the last time I heard someone mutter such a sexist thing as what you did? Are you saying that women are toys? That they shouldn’t think for themselves? Trust me, you need to rethink your position for the sake of your own soul.

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Originally Posted by That Darn Republican

You believe in lusts... you indulge them
you war against anything that convicts the beauty [in your mind] of sensual self indulgences that is not what we were created for.
.

Last time I heard something like above, it was on a movie where a girl picked up the phone and there was heavy breathing on the other line, and words like above dripped out of a nauseating voice. How do you know what lusts others partake? Can you hear them in your head?

Oregon Elephant · #13 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:01 PM

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Originally Posted by That Darn Republican

You are not qualified to make any commentary on Biblical content as you have not submitted your life to God's will therefore you would be speaking completely out of ignorance and further invalidate your position.

Anyone can make any comments on the bible. After all, christians are suppose to convert to their belief, show the light to the world. How are people suppose to believe anything you say regarding the bible if they can't even comment on it?

That Darn Republican · #14 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:03 PM

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This comment is a shame to your religion. It is a thing of vile intent and disgraceful, malevolent meaning with no care to intelligence or ethics whatsoever.

Christ isn't about religion... your faith in your beliefs are just as religious as any other man made dogma. But your words were supposed to shame me into a retreat? Not so, I am not a turn the other cheeker. I deal with nonsense straight one, like this silliness you foist as such an affront to Christian sensibilities. Not so, they may sit well with you - but you are ignorant of the Word therefore are not council I need even hold to appease. Listen to your self? labels... just incidiary label, but no substance. Any way I am not here to argue with you.

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No, not all Christians are a problem. Many are good people. Many are not. And your words fall into the latter category; when was the last time I heard someone mutter such a sexist thing as what you did? Are you saying that women are toys? That they shouldn't’t think for themselves? Trust me, you need to rethink your position for the sake of your own soul.

Christians that heed Gods Word and submit to it are good people, but [according to His Word] not all that claim Lord, Lord! are His followers -- so not much teeth in you counter there. They have don nothing but benefit every society the have peacefully inhabited. You on the other hand are typical of the ignorant rhetoric that gets spouted when someone doesn't agree with your world view politics, now that isn't very adult now is it? Now as for your advocating the rhetoric of feminism by somehow managing to be offended because I highlighted and uncovered the propagandistic subterfuge unwinding in the comments -- sorry I didn't kowtow to political correctness, not my style. As for the sake of my own soul? are you serious... boy you are special brand of defiant aren't you? It is because understand what the Word of God teaches and don't interpret what He is guiding me in through His Word that I am ever so resolute on what I said. Very foolish comments from you, your colors are showing. God Words tells us to follow His Words is never going to make us popular in the eye of those who worship their flesh.

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Last time I heard something like above, it was on a movie where a girl picked up the phone and there was heavy breathing on the other line, and words like above dripped out of a nauseating voice. How do you know what lusts others partake? Can you hear them in your head?

Of course... Hollowood has nothing but movies to advocate positions a mind like yours would take. What that supposed to mean something? I don't live in the world of the subject - I live in the real world. That world was created by a Supreme Being that holds a timeless constant, right is right -- wrong is wrong. On can do something right and be wrong, that is life, but no one can do wrong ever possibly right can come of it. You'd do well to consider the latter.

We'll just have to agree to disagree. The last time I heard something as rabidly unjustifiable as your overall position... I was at a mechanic being told I have a $1,500.00 fuel line repair needed, when it was nothing more than a simple recall matter that was [in the end] free... just because it's between your ears counterpointing doesn't mean you listen to it.

Slartibartfas · #15 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:14 PM

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Originally Posted by That Darn Republican

The reality is it takes far more faith to say man evolved over a scientological etch-a-sketch of how many millions upon billions of years...

No it does not.

Evolutionary science made huge progresses in the last years. May I bring an example? Take the "Introns" in our DNA. They make up a huge part of our entire DNA and until lately it was believed that its just junk and trash inserted by "egoist DNA" that means viruses etc.

Now this view has quite changed. It has changed because scientists discovered how these Introns, while not having often enough a too high worth for the individual, play a very important role in the evolution of races. It actually facilitates mutation and most importantly it reduces the probability of senseless mutation and increases the chances of a positive mutation. (positive means, that mutation leads to a gain of functions)

Thats just one example, progress is made on many issues. For example what important role self manipulating RNA played in the very early stages of life might have played.

And with the increasing understanding of what our DNA and the one of other organisms codify we will also start being able to reconstruct the very traces of evolution that are conserved in it. Down on a molecular level.

So in my opinion its not much of a problem to say, evolution is the best theory available to explain how life came into existence and developed into what we know today.

And many very devote Christians don't have the slightest problem with this. As evolution says nothing about a god, many in fact believe that evolution is work of god. Nothing wrong with that. That statement is beyond science and therefore belongs to the realm of religion. So its a question of believe, not of science.
Not so with evolution itself, its a question of science, not religion.

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Originally Posted by counterpointing

Selective breading would be pretty hard to disprove for the following reason: that is how we breed dogs and it works. This is just a point; I do not discuss it often though selective breeding is hard to ignore. There may be more to the system then that.

You know the irony?
It has been actually a monk (an Austrian btw, which makes me proud

) who prove the concept of selective breeding being possible on different plants. I am not aware that this monk ever lost his believe in God though, just because of his scientific work and results.

counterpointing · #16 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:27 PM

To: That Darn Republican

I don’t mind arguing with supposed logic that advocates the following traits: voices heard within the head that are thought to be divine, the hating of women, or the ambition of world transformation. All of these I take as fallacy and nothing else. Therefore it is easy to argue with.

That Darn Republican · #17 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:32 PM

Mr. Elephant

Isaiah said to:

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"Come now, and let us reason together," Says the LORD, "Though your sins are like scarlet, They shall be as white as snow; Though they are red like crimson, They shall be as wool."

Meaning not only use common sense but use the same tools used in practical reasoning to gain right understanding of His Word in our lives. That would be not arguing something you have no knowledge of, that is scriptural. What does the Word say about a fool not speaking? I didn't say not to read the bible, that would be antithetical to spiritual growth and the opposite of discipleship. No, lol! not what I mean -- I don't' quite know how you came to that out of what I said but I want to make that clear.

It is not out of anything but love that I actually take the time to be as absolutely clear in my responses so people get the clear understanding that there is a standard -- we didn't create it, but we see its truth and submit to it and watch its fruit [evidence] in our lives. We don't change it for political correctness, that's all.

Bradgriff · #18 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:33 PM

Darn Republican......you're pretty new here right? Welcome, good to have you.

You put together a nice passionate case. Every 2 or 3 months someone shows up with the same type of thing, and yours is in the more rational range however I stiil sense the usual manic urgency to prove a point, and that is crowding out the fertile area where an exchanges of ideas should be taking place.

The people on this site tend to be quite well read and reasonable for the most part, and we have been over the Science V Creation thing ad nausium. Maybe you've got some new stuff to bring to the table

that would be nifty.

But try to take a little time off of being right. You'll fit in better, and there will be receptive people and all that, you know

That Darn Republican · #19 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 04:57 PM

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"So in my opinion its not much of a problem to say, evolution is the best theory available to explain how life came into existence and developed into what we know today."

I respect your opinion, but there are so many gaping holes in the evolutionary argument it is hard to hold on to as anything more than a fairytale for the godless. Something you can grab a hold of has answers -- those answers resonate within you uttermost being, Creation Science has not only those answers, but the key-holder opens your eyes to the beauty and splendor of His creation -- now there are points within evolution that are not evolutionary points such what you mentioned like selective breeding you'll find support of that in Creation. But arguments regarding mutations, are hard to prove because the origin of the mutation. That is one of the single hardest points for evolutionary scientists to prove. Lastly, evolution isn't science... it is the hope of those who mock. There is more science in Creation because evidence is half of science period. Christians who who may submit to creation through evolution may not be Christians at all, but I am not here to argue that -- again, it is not what you claim... it is what you can prove, and evolution hasn't proved much, it really hasn't. It has just had the favored position of being rather fascistically supported by an educational system that wants to indoctrinate children for very obvious social reasons -- if you believe in nothing, then you have to believe what I tell you. That is not learning I submit to you, nor is it objective.

Lastly, evolution simply doesn't gell with people. They somehow know better so why we give it more credence then we need is beyond me? I enjyoed reading your repsonse... I look forward to more civil debates on the matter in the future

That Darn Republican · #20 (**permalink**) 10-14-2007, 05:02 PM

Bradgriff,

Thank you for your welcome interleaved with a caveate... at any rate, always more evidence, same position. It gets more and more exciting as time goes by, objective science is learning so much more and will provide much to debate, if there is something to debate [in the end]. Scientists aren't jumping ships because for nothing... but for something, something they are finding more and more of, edivence.