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Old 03-28-2008, 03:33 PM   #141 (permalink)
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Only militarily...

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Originally Posted by AzTeK View Post
Any leader in his sane mind of any country in a similar position to Israel would be using extreme caution and restraint. Don't forget that the 2007 Israeli military budget amounted to $9,4 billion. The US military aid to Israel in 2006 was $2,3 Billion. In other words, the US finances around 25% of Israels army.............................................. .
Seems to me Israel can ONLY win militarily. Perplexed? - Well, look where "peace" with those backstabbing Pals has brought us... Israel is far from reaching security, Hamas has DEMOCRATICALLY gotten control of some of the territories and the Palestinians have nothing to eat.

In a society that values bombs and combat, in a religion that calls for nothing less than the total destruction of the "infidels" - anyone who dares not to read the Koran, in a city where along with milk being nursed to a baby, hatred and malice are shoved down its throat, even before the first word is spoken - NOTHING but strong, compelling, shocking into a state of stupor combat can make them stop, even for a little while.

Total victory? - Of course not! Never! We can never win.
There's just not any other alternative. We are doomed to live by the sword, that's just how it is. If war doesn't make it, peace most certainly WON'T in such a society.
Peace in Islam is perceived as weakness, as groveling.

As for US/international support, we most certainly appreciate it, but as you have more than once or twice seen Israel cannot be dictated for. We will protect our people, we will not rest until sufficient detterence is back in place, and we will take no "kind advice" when it comes to protecting ourselves. In the Holocaust we were weak and we had no support. The US was aware and was dragging its heels ending the suffering. NEVER AGAIN. We will not be killed in our own country! And if terrorists are "smart" enough to hide inside innocent population, well, then we will "outsmart" them, no matter what.

It's nice how you casually mention how half a million Iraqis got killed for about 2,000 Americans in 9/11. Do I smell here the 'double-standards' rat?? - As I've said - no amout of money in the world will ever dictate what we can or cannot do. If we comply, it is only because we decide to comply, out of our own sound judgement, not out of fear!

To sum it up - the US has never and will never be in our shoes, so don't try to act like you are.
I love Americans, I really do... I'm not just saying that. You are our brothers, and brothers may sometimes disagree. Let's just agree to disagree here, at least until you've had a chance to live here and see it first hand.
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Old 03-28-2008, 03:44 PM   #142 (permalink)
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Anti-Semitism...

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Originally Posted by LoveDubai View Post
How can you say that Arabs are anti semites?!!

Arabs have never been Anti semites! Anti semites come from europe, so dont get confussed!

Wikepedia - Anti-Semitism:
Antisemitism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Antisemitism (alternatively spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism, also known as judeophobia) is prejudice and hostility toward Jews as a religious, racial, or ethnic group. While the term's etymology indicates that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic peoples, since its creation it has been used exclusively to refer to hostility towards Jews.

Arabs hate Jews almost instinctively...... the fact that they haven't mass-murdered us yet like the nazis, doesn't mean they wouldn't if they could. (That's why, BTW Iran mustn't get nukes!)
Arabs are anti-Semitic by definition.
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Old 03-29-2008, 05:51 PM   #143 (permalink)
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Wikepedia - Anti-Semitism:
Antisemitism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Antisemitism (alternatively spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism, also known as judeophobia) is prejudice and hostility toward Jews as a religious, racial, or ethnic group. While the term's etymology indicates that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic peoples, since its creation it has been used exclusively to refer to hostility towards Jews.

Arabs hate Jews almost instinctively...... the fact that they haven't mass-murdered us yet like the nazis, doesn't mean they wouldn't if they could. (That's why, BTW Iran mustn't get nukes!)
Arabs are anti-Semitic by definition.
You should look at the fact that Israel gives unfair treatment to Arabs in the first place, they colonised the lands and are violating the geneva convention, the Zionist regime is just like Nazi Germany, where as to the Nazi oppressed the European Jews, the Zionists in Israel has oppressed the Palestinian Arabs.

(BTW, the only reason USA and Israel are scared of Iran is because they are a threat to their agenda to the Middle East, the US shouldn't even have any bussiness in the Middle East in the first place.)

You should also note that in a recent poll, 68% of Israelis have a racist attitude to the Arabs, they vandalise the Mosques and the Churches, chant racist slurs to Arabs and they would rather have an underqualified Israeli Jew than an overqualified Palestinian Arab in a job.

Besides, the Zionists are not even suppose to be in Palestine in the first place, they are not even the original inhabitants of the land of Canaan, they are from an empire of Khazar that was toppled long ago, the Khazarians migrated to Europe which makes the European Jews not really the Hebrews, the original inhabitants have converted to Islam, some others went to Africa and Spain but not to central Europe and the Balkans, excluding the south Balkans.

Therfore it gives no right for Zionists to kill who they want or steal the lands from anyone, if they claim to be Semites, then why are they killing their Semitic cousins? I will tell you why, they want a society with no non-Jews, they want to cause pain to others who weren't even involved in the Genocide, their goals are perverse and immoral at best, in fact the Nazis ideologies aren't even left off, it is picked by the very people they wanted to exterminate, here is a number of examples:

1. Did you know that non-Jewish Israelis cannot buy or lease land in Israel? A Jew from any country in the world is guaranteed citizenship in Israel, while the Palestinians who have been there for centuries are oppressed and persecuted.

2. Did you know that instead of sewing an insignia on clothing to distinguish race (like the Germans did to the Jews before WW2), Palestinian license plates in Israel are color coded to distinguish Jews from non-Jews?

3. Did you know that East Jerusalem, the West Bank, Gaza, and the Golan Heights are all considered by the entire world community, including the United States and the United Nations, to be occupied territory and NOT part of the State of Israel?

4. Did you know that Israel allots 85% of the water resources for Jews, and the remaining 15% is divided among all Palestinians in the territories? For example in Hebron, 85% of the water is set aside for about 400 Jewish settlers, while the remaining 15% is distributed among Hebron's 120, 000 Palestinians?

5. Did you know that the United States awards Israel $5 billion in aid each year from American tax dollars?

6. Did you know that US aid to Israel ($1.8 billion annually in military aid alone) exceeds the aid the US grants to the entire African continent? This aid is used both to buy American weaponry and to buy arms made in Israel.

7. Did you know that Israel is awaiting an additional $4 billion worth of American military hardware, including new F-16s and Apache and Blackhawk helicopters. As Israel's main ally and supporter internationally, the United States is committed to maintaining the Jewish state's "qualitative edge" in weapons over its neighbours.

8. Did you know that the U.S. administration has notified Congress on numerous occasions that Israel has violated the rules on how US-supplied weapons are used? (In 1978, 1979 and 1982 during fighting in Lebanon, and once after Israel's bombing of an Iraqi nuclear reactor in 1981.)

9. Did you know that Israel is the only country in the Middle East that refuses to sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and bars international inspections from its sites?

10. Did you know that high-ranking military officers in the Israeli Defence Forces have admitted publicly that unarmed prisoners of war have been summarily executed by the Israeli forces?

11. Did you know that Israel blew up an American diplomatic facility in Egypt and attacked a US warship in international waters (the USS Liberty), killing 33 and wounding 177 American sailors and the US did nothing about it? (Imagine if an Islamic country like Iraq did this!)

12. Did you know that Israel stands in defiance of 69 United Nations Security Council Resolutions?

13. Did you know that Israel is explicitly dedicated to the policy of maintaining a distinct Jewish character?

14. Did you know that Israel's current Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, was found by an Israeli court to be "personally and directly responsible" for the Sabra and Shatilla massacre in Lebanon where more than a thousand innocent Palestinian men, women, and children were axed to death or lined up and shot in cold blood?

15. Did you know that on May 20, 1990, a group of unarmed Palestinian labourers were lined up and murdered by an Israeli solider as they sat waiting for transportation back to Gaza? The terrified labourers who gathered in an area of southern Israel known as Rishon Lezion (known to Palestinians by its Arabic name Oyon Qara) handed their ID cards to the Israeli soldier. The soldiers ordered the distressed labourers to kneel down and face the ground and unexpectedly showered them with a barrage of bullets, killing seven and wounding many others. Needless to say, the soldier was not charged with any crime.

16. Did you know that until as recently as 1988, Israelis were permitted to run "Jews Only" job ads?

17. Did you know that the Israeli Foreign Ministry pays six US public relations firms to promote a "positive image" of Israel to the American public?

18. Did you know that Sharon's coalition government includes a party--Molodet--which advocates ethnic cleansing by openly calling for the forced expulsion of all Palestinians from the occupied territories?

19. Did you know that recently-declassified documents indicate that David Ben-Gurion approved of the forced expulsion of Arabs from all Palestinian territory in 1948?

20. Did you know that the former chief rabbi of Israel, Rabbi Ovadia Yossef, who is also a founder and spiritual leader of the religious Shas party (Israel's third largest political party) openly advocates a 'Final Solution' to annihilate the Palestinians? Speaking at the widely broadcast sermon marking the last Passover, he declared of the Palestinians: "The Lord shall return their deeds on their own heads, waste their seed and exterminate them, devastate them and vanish them from this world. It is forbidden to be merciful to them. You must send missiles to them and annihilate them. They are evil and damnable."

21. Did you know that Palestinian refugees make up the largest portion of the refugee population in the world?

22. Did you know that Palestinian Christians are considered the "living stones" of Christianity because they are the direct descendants of the disciples of Jesus Christ? And the Palestinian Christians stand united with their Muslim brethren in the struggle against the Israeli occupation.

23. Did you know that despite a ban on torture by Israel's High Court of Justice, torture has continued unabated by Shin Bet interrogators on Palestinian prisoners?

24. Did you know that despite every Israeli attempt to disrupt Palestinian education, Palestinians have the highest ratio of PhDs per capita in the world?

25. Did you know that the right of self-determination is guaranteed to every human being under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights [December, 1948], yet Palestinians were/are expected to negotiate for this right under the Oslo Accords?

26. Did you know that despite what is widely perpetuated and written in the history books that the Arabs attacked Israel in the 1967 war, it was Israel who attacked the Arab countries first, capturing Jerusalem and the West Bank, and called the attack a pre-emptive strike?

27. Did you know that, as an occupying power, Israel has a particular responsibility under the Geneva Conventions to protect Palestinian civilians?

28. Did you know that, despite Ariel Sharon's public call for a unilateral ceasefire, Israeli soldiers have not stopped shooting, killing or bulldozing Palestinian homes? The most recent example of this is the murder of three innocent women who were shot by an Israeli tank as they sat in their tent!

29. Did you know that the Zionists have been trying to destroy Masjid al-Aqsa and the Dome of the Rock for the last 50 years by digging underground tunnels beneath the sites to weaken its foundation causing it to collapse?

30. Nelson Mandela called the Israeli government an apartheid regime, just like South Africa used to be.
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Old 03-29-2008, 06:21 PM   #144 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
Seems to me Israel can ONLY win militarily. Perplexed? - Well, look where "peace" with those backstabbing Pals has brought us... Israel is far from reaching security, Hamas has DEMOCRATICALLY gotten control of some of the territories and the Palestinians have nothing to eat.

In a society that values bombs and combat, in a religion that calls for nothing less than the total destruction of the "infidels" - anyone who dares not to read the Koran, in a city where along with milk being nursed to a baby, hatred and malice are shoved down its throat, even before the first word is spoken - NOTHING but strong, compelling, shocking into a state of stupor combat can make them stop, even for a little while.

Total victory? - Of course not! Never! We can never win.
There's just not any other alternative. We are doomed to live by the sword, that's just how it is. If war doesn't make it, peace most certainly WON'T in such a society.
Peace in Islam is perceived as weakness, as groveling.

As for US/international support, we most certainly appreciate it, but as you have more than once or twice seen Israel cannot be dictated for. We will protect our people, we will not rest until sufficient detterence is back in place, and we will take no "kind advice" when it comes to protecting ourselves. In the Holocaust we were weak and we had no support. The US was aware and was dragging its heels ending the suffering. NEVER AGAIN. We will not be killed in our own country! And if terrorists are "smart" enough to hide inside innocent population, well, then we will "outsmart" them, no matter what.

It's nice how you casually mention how half a million Iraqis got killed for about 2,000 Americans in 9/11. Do I smell here the 'double-standards' rat?? - As I've said - no amout of money in the world will ever dictate what we can or cannot do. If we comply, it is only because we decide to comply, out of our own sound judgement, not out of fear!

To sum it up - the US has never and will never be in our shoes, so don't try to act like you are.
I love Americans, I really do... I'm not just saying that. You are our brothers, and brothers may sometimes disagree. Let's just agree to disagree here, at least until you've had a chance to live here and see it first hand.
Or Israel cannot win at all, the occupation has all the Natives of the land angry over the fact that people from Europe came and stole the lands, Hamas was formed to combat the Israeli tyranny, the methods of Hamas maybe questionable but the way Israel puts it, they have no choice but to use war as a mean of exclusion of government, besides the Palestinians don't have anything to eat because the Israeli government blockaded Gaza.

Our religion doesn't say we want the destruction of the "infidel", you are just stereotyping Islam, Muslims don't make fun of Judaism and stereotype it, besides we don't grow up in hatred of people, the Israeli are tought to hate non-Jews themselves, they massacre Palestinians with barbaric enjoyment of it, Israel is the real tyrant here, they kill the populations, they are the ones who brought terrorists upon themselves, the 9/11 was a separate incident, they made it big to make us Arabs look bad, if Israel is "protecting" itself as the biased American media puts it, then why do kill innocent people, Palestinians are ones who need protection, they have every right to expel the foriegn invaders and save themselves from the slow genocide the Israelis are doing to them, Israel is just like Nazi Germany, they bully and kill the Arab population, but when an Arab retaliates, the Israelis make it a big thing, so get this thing right, Zionism is a perverse ideology, they even stated it at the protocols of the Elder Zion, the Zionists tried to make the man who published the book look like an anti-Semitic loon, he just published it after he discovered the documents.

Anyways, whenever the Israelis oppress, people won't let them kill whomever they please, they will fight back, they will fight hard and with determination to counter whatever atrocities Israel is trying to do.
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Old 03-29-2008, 09:25 PM   #145 (permalink)
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Shameful lies...

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You should look at the fact that Israel gives unfair treatment to Arabs in the first place............................................. .................

Comparing us to the nazis takes any basic respect I have for every single human being on first encounter, and shoves it right down the drain.

I don't know where you get your information (You didn't even enclose a link to support your so-called "facts"), but over a million Arabs live in Israel and I've personally met some who claim they would NEVER give their blue identity card (Israeli citizenship) to go to any Arab country, to live.

Not only do Arabs have equal rights, here in Israel and enjoy democracy, but there are numerous affirmative action laws, which give Arabs and other minorities many advantages over local Jews.
Israel is a democratic state which gives equal rights to all of its citizens. I can't control what people have to say about Arabs, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out what you're saying is correct and Jews here really DO prefer an unqualified Jew over an overqualified Arab.

The news here are rampant every few years about Arabs who have been working for an employer for years and years, have been taken into his home, have eaten breakfast, lunch and dinner with him, only to get betrayed and get killed with the entire family one day.

What happens is - when an extremist finds out a certain Arab works in Israel, he tries to brain-wash and eventually manages to recruit him. The road to hell is very short from that point. All trust in Palestinians has been lost. I'm not ashamed to say I want them as far away from here as possible. I mean them no harm, none whatsoever. I wish them only good things, as I believe not all of them are bad people, but I'd like to make peace and leave them to build their country with NO help from us and with a huge cement wall to keep us as far apart as possible.

Did you know that Israel has been financing the PA for a long time now?
When an Israeli family fails to pay electricity bill, phone or water bill ETC. the service gets cut off pretty quickly.
Israel has given FREE electricity, water and phone services to the citizens of the PA/Hamas territories. They are unable to pay and these services still work! How absurd is that when the Pals are so hell bent on exterminating us by whatever means comes their way?! How utterly absurd is that when average Israelis who can't pay the bills, get "Suspension of Services" notices in no time at all?!

Arab professors have jobs in Israel, Arab doctors have jobs in Israel. Not so long ago an Arab professor at a Jewish university didn't let a student in the class, because the student was wearing IDF uniform.
Now tell me - whether you agree or not with what that professor did, would that happen in ANY Muslim country?!

NOW READ YOUR HISTORY AND COMPARE THIS TO THE NAZIS!

I haven't even mentioned Arab representatives in the Israeli Knesset!

I'm not going to respond to any of the other things you wrote, as you wrote pages upon pages, and I have things to do.
Honestly, after that dreadful comparison to the nazis = total and misleading propaganda, and after losing every little ounce of respect I may have had for you, I have no real motivation to further speak to you.

Good day.

Last edited by Ronnie; 03-29-2008 at 09:31 PM.
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Old 03-29-2008, 09:39 PM   #146 (permalink)
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Come on... you know damn well what people mean when they say "anti-Semites"
Yes, being prejudiced against people of a semitic background, and the Oxford English Dictionary defines a Semite as...

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Originally Posted by The Oxford English Dictionary
Semite: A person belonging to the race of mankind which includes most of the peoples mentioned in Gen. x. as descended from Shem son of Noah, as the Hebrews, Arabs, Assyrians, and Aramæans. Also, a person speaking a Semitic language as his native tongue.
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Old 03-29-2008, 09:46 PM   #147 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
Arabs hate Jews almost instinctively...... the fact that they haven't mass-murdered us yet like the nazis, doesn't mean they wouldn't if they could. (That's why, BTW Iran mustn't get nukes!)
Arabs are anti-Semitic by definition.
Would you care to elaborate? What makes Arabs so anti-Jewish by definition?
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Old 03-29-2008, 10:07 PM   #148 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kazikli Bey View Post
Yes, being prejudiced against people of a semitic background, and the Oxford English Dictionary defines a Semite as...
I can quote too ;-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia;

Antisemitism (alternatively spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism, also known as judeophobia) is prejudice and hostility toward Jews as a religious, racial, or ethnic group. While the term's etymology indicates that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic peoples, since its creation it has been used exclusively to refer to hostility towards Jews.
Antisemitism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 03-29-2008, 10:27 PM   #149 (permalink)
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I will concede that its usage is used against the Jewish people, but i'm sort of an English Purist. I detest how words have been distorted out of their original meaning and will never use it to describe judeo-prejudice.
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Old 03-29-2008, 11:35 PM   #150 (permalink)
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I will concede that its usage is used against the Jewish people, but i'm sort of an English Purist. I detest how words have been distorted out of their original meaning and will never use it to describe judeo-prejudice.
Well then, if you are an English Purist, we're on the same page... English is my favorite language and I would never abuse it.
In this case, anti-Semitism is a term in English (See: my favorite language) and no one can deny its usage, but... whatever... ;-)
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