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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2007, 12:49 PM
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War of words -Media and the transatlantic relationship

The American- European tensions from a couple of years ago , around the start of the Iraq war, seem to cool down, and so it might be time to look at the role the media played in it. Anti- americanism and anti- europeanism are sometimes based on real cultural differences but more dangerous are the simple cliches and stereotypes that hide behind articles , headlines, and editorials........


War of Words: The Role of the Media in the Trans-Atlantic Relationship - International - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News
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Old 04-26-2007, 09:23 AM
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I think it would be a good idea to do some research on this subject. It is kind of sad how polarized people can become without knowing anything of real substance of the people on the other side.
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Old 04-26-2007, 09:44 AM
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This split does worry me, but I think to a degree it's inevitable.
The US and Europe are similar, but not the same. I expect that as time goes by, "The West" will split into Europe and the US and co, with Britain trying unsuccessfully to bridge the gap. We will be two civilisations rather than one.
In the 19th century, people believed that we were similar because we all White. These days, such views are unfashionable. In the post-war period, we believed we were similar because we were free and fighting Communism. But today that's starting to split.
Our current enemy, Islamic terror, is anti-western yes, but it's particularly anti-American. When bombings happen in London and Madrid, people see it as an attack not on Western countries, but on countries that support America. I think that, combined with America's increasing inwardness, the two continents will turn away from each other.
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Old 04-26-2007, 02:52 PM
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So...... after the war we were close because we helped you guys out, but now that we have people trying to kill us Europe is slowly but surely saying "Sorry guys, good luck with that"?
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Old 04-26-2007, 03:55 PM
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Kind of. When the Afghan war started, most Europeans supported that. But not Iraq. I think that triggered a feeling that Americans were arrogant and trigger-happy... not that they deserved problems, but that they brought these problems on themselves, and that it's their responsibility to deal with them.
Obviously, views on this kind of thing are both varied and fluid, but that's the way I think it's going.
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... I am surprised at your insolence in writing to me at all. You know, as I know, that I bought this constituency... may God's curse light upon you and may it make your women as open and as free to the excise officers as your wives and daughters have always been to me while I have represented your scoundrel corporation.
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Old 04-26-2007, 04:08 PM
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That just seems weird to me because for those of us who believe we need to get the job done over there, it seems that we have Europe's safety in mind too.
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Neither am I the means to any end others may wish to accomplish. I am not a tool for their use. I am not a servant of their needs. I am not a bandage for their wounds. I am not a sacrifice on their altars. ... I owe nothing to my brothers, nor do I gather debts from them. I ask no one to live for me, nor do I live for others. I covet no mans soul, nor is my soul theirs to covet.

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Old 04-26-2007, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by FRYandBENDER View Post
That just seems weird to me because for those of us who believe we need to get the job done over there, it seems that we have Europe's safety in mind too.
Well, the Iraq war had never ever much to do about caring for Europes safety, I would say. In fact it is nowadays the greatest threat against Europes safety. After all, everything that lies between the EU and Iraq is... you guessed it: Turkey.

When Turkey might join the EU, hell will pretty much start directly from our eastern border onwards... thanks to the US.
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Last edited by Slartibartfas : 04-26-2007 at 04:38 PM.
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Old 04-26-2007, 04:38 PM
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I have a question. We have currently a large number of articles in the Austrian media about the rising divide between the US and the EU. And that the EU should will have to show a bit more self consciousness in the future.

Perhaps this is just a current Austrian news item, but I think the problem behind it will come up sooner or later in the whole of Europe. There are two specific issues:

The BAWAG case: The Austrian bank "BAWAG" has been bought by the American neoconservative investor Cerberus. This investor forced the BAWAG to cancel all accounts and every business that falls under the sanctions of an American law that says among others Cubans are on the black list, ie everyone who has the bad luck of having a Cuban nationality must not make any business with the BAWAG (owned by an American now) anymore.

This discrimination on nothing more than nationality is illegal in Austria, but moreover is it illegal to enforce American law in Europe. There is already a legal trial in the making on both the EU level as also in Austria.

The second issue, is one that has a real European dimension and will be also a very important issue on EU level for all members: The Nabucco pipeline and other large deals between the Austrian petrol company OMV. The US warned the OMV not to make such deals with Iran. It would not be the first time the US sanctions a foreign company, just because it does not follow US law outside of the US.
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Old 04-26-2007, 05:19 PM
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That just seems weird to me because for those of us who believe we need to get the job done over there, it seems that we have Europe's safety in mind too.
And I'm sure you do have Europe's safety in mind, but to Europeans the danger is your fault in the first place. There were no Islamic terror bombings in Europe before the invasion of Iraq, and many see the US as having stimulated terrorism.
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... I am surprised at your insolence in writing to me at all. You know, as I know, that I bought this constituency... may God's curse light upon you and may it make your women as open and as free to the excise officers as your wives and daughters have always been to me while I have represented your scoundrel corporation.
I have the honour to be... your obliged humble servant, Anthony Henley
- MPs reply to constituent, mid 1700s
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Old 05-16-2007, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Brother Oz View Post
And I'm sure you do have Europe's safety in mind, but to Europeans the danger is your fault in the first place. There were no Islamic terror bombings in Europe before the invasion of Iraq, and many see the US as having stimulated terrorism.
Let's see,
In 1988, there was the bombing of Pan Am Flight 103
All the following occurred in 1995 (all by GIA in France):
On July 25, 1995, a gas bottle exploded in the Saint-Michel - Notre-Dame station of line B of the RER (Paris regional train network). 8 were killed and 80 wounded.
On August 17, a bomb at the Arc de Triomphe wounded 17 people. On August 26, a huge bomb was found on the railroad tracks of a high-speed rail line near Lyon. On September 3, a bomb malfunctioned in a square in Paris, wounding 4. On September 7, a car bomb at a Jewish school in Lyon wounded 14.

Islamic terrorism did not begin in Europe post-2003.
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