Down with Chavez - Political Forum

Sebelius for VP, not Hillary · 12-01-2007, 08:35 PM

Chavez apparently does not believe in democracy. He's setting himself up as the next Castro.

Bloomberg.com: Latin America

Quote:

UN `Concerned' by Chavez Constitution Plan, Universal Says
By Guillermo Parra-Bernal

Dec. 1 (Bloomberg) -- The United Nations and human- rights organizations said Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez's proposed constitution threatens free speech and other civil rights, El Universal newspaper reported.

Analysts Hina Jilani, Ambey Ligabo and Leandro Despouy, members of the UN's human-rights council, said a clause allowing removal of Supreme Justice Court judges who challenge decrees issued during declared emergencies runs counter to democracy, Universal said. Restrictions on speech and news media allowed during an ``emergency'' also undermines liberties, Universal said, citing the analysts.

Under the changes, political parties and non-partisan organizations will be banned from receiving donations from abroad, eroding their finances, the UN analysts told Universal. For non-government group Human Rights Watch, the reform plan, which will be put to vote tomorrow, dwarfs the power of citizens in the oil-rich nation, Universal said.

I've also read something about how Chavez wants to ban term limits and wants to stay in power for the rest of his life. Is that true?

joep182 · 12-01-2007, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.B. Du Bois

I've also read something about how Chavez wants to ban term limits and wants to stay in power for the rest of his life. Is that true?

He wants to remove term limits (just as a British PM can remain in office as long as the people wish him to remain so), thus deepening the countries democracy. If the people of a country want someone to be their leader but the law forbids them, then it cant be considered democratic.

On your other point he has said he is willing to serve as long as the Venezuelan people want him to.

Also anyone wanting rid of Chavez should contemplate the alternative. That is the people who want to overthrow democracy, the people who advocate violence and terrorism. Is that the people the west really want to be associated with ?

Kazikli Bey · 12-01-2007, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joep182

Also anyone wanting rid of Chavez should contemplate the alternative. That is the people who want to overthrow democracy, the people who advocate violence and terrorism. Is that the people the west really want to be associated with ?

American corporations will associate themselves with anyone willing to boost their profits, no matter what their politics, i mean, have a look at the Kingdom of Suad, can't tell me that's a glistening beacon of democracy.

joep182 · 12-01-2007, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kazikli Bey

American corporations will associate themselves with anyone willing to boost their profits, no matter what their politics, i mean, have a look at the Kingdom of Suad, can't tell me that's a glistening beacon of democracy.

You dont need to convince me of that. My statement is more aimed at the ordinary person, I'm sure the average person doesn't want to be associated with these types, the corporations and governments, well we know they have no morals.

Kazikli Bey · 12-01-2007, 09:39 PM

Of course the ordinary person doesn't want to be associated with those types, but they don't really have much of a chance when almost everything they teach is biased or manipulated by the media.

Sebelius for VP, not Hillary · 12-01-2007, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kazikli Bey

American corporations will associate themselves with anyone willing to boost their profits, no matter what their politics, i mean, have a look at the Kingdom of Suad, can't tell me that's a glistening beacon of democracy.

Who cares who American corporations will associate themselves with? I thought that the subject was Chavez and democracy.

Sebelius for VP, not Hillary · 12-01-2007, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joep182

He wants to remove term limits (just as a British PM can remain in office as long as the people wish him to remain so), thus deepening the countries democracy. If the people of a country want someone to be their leader but the law forbids them, then it cant be considered democratic.

Well a Prime Minister is much easier to get rid of than a President. A parliament can get rid of the Prime Minister with a vote of no confidence.

Sebelius for VP, not Hillary · 12-01-2007, 10:50 PM

The question remains if it is acceptable to be able to:

Declare an emergency and then:

(1) Sack Supreme Court Justices
(2) Take control of the media
(3) Detain citizens without charge (I heard on National Public Radio, that the new constitution allows this too)

joep182 · 12-01-2007, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.B. Du Bois

The question remains if it is acceptable to be able to:

Declare an emergency and then:

(1) Sack Supreme Court Justices
(2) Take control of the media
(3) Detain citizens without charge (I heard on National Public Radio, that the new constitution allows this too)

In short yes. These are powers most countries have.

Sebelius for VP, not Hillary · 12-01-2007, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joep182

In short yes. These are powers most countries have.

Can you show me where in British law and the US Constitution these things are allowed?