Everyone


If scientific opinion is divided on this, then you know nothing and your views are worthless. You have no knowledge and hence should keep quiet.

I agree that reducing pollution is good but it is only a guess that it leads to global warming. The truth is no one knows.



Big Bro

Where do you get off saying that no one has any knowledge so we should all keep quiet? The truth is, scientist are fairly certain, but not positive, that it is human caused, and it will likely lead to major harm to the world as a whole (not just climates, but economies and societies), so we should slow down our use of oil and other CO2 emitting fuels until we know for sure.

You shouldn't walk blindly in the dark if you have a flashlight in your pocket and you only need to stop to put in the batteries.

Oregon Elephant


This issue has become politicized. It is a question for scientists to determine. If I am blind without a flashlight then at least I have the honesty to admit it.



Big Bro

It has become politicized, but that doesn't mean there is no science at all to be found. It just means that the science is bloodly hard to find while weeding out the politics. But there is science, and these things can be discussed in an unbiased way, un-political way. But before we can do that, we have to move beyond saying that those who disagree with us are just politically bias.

The best way to do this, is to avoid adjectives. Adjectives are almost always opinions. When one says, "the meaningless war did..." and spinkle other adjectives in the mix, it hides the truth behind one's opinion and therefore makes it harder to convince others. If you take out the adjectives, you are left with just the facts, or no statment at all (in which case, what you would have said, would have been completely opinion and most likely bias).

we should be working toward nonpolluting , renewable energy production for our health's sake and to break the oil dependency
even if Global warming has nothing to do wih mankind.

my preferences are solar, hydrogen fuel cells , wind , hydro , and as a temporary measure biofuels

That's true, even if you don't believe in global warming, there is still the benefit of becoming more independent as a country from foriegn oil. We don't need to be attached by the hip to a part of the world that is not very happy with us.

I will point out that the issue is far more politicised in the US than it is anywhere in europe. The only debate going on in the UK is which party is doing more to promote green issues.

Humberto Rosa, the chief delegate from Portugal, which holds the rotating presidency of the European Union, said the talks to be hosted by the Bush Administration in Hawaii in January would be “meaningless” if there was no deal this week here at the conference on the resort island of Bali.

Germany’s environment minister, Sigmar Gabriel, told reporters here, “No result in Bali means no Major Economies Meeting.” He was referring to the formal name of the proposed American-sponsored talks. Louis J Sheehan

Very true. Here in Australia, now Bush's lickspittle John Howard has been removed to the trash heap of history where he belongs, the new government immediately ratified the Kyoto Treaty and joined the civilised world.

The debate on whether anthopogenic climate change is happening finished years ago. The backwardness and ignorance coming out of the USA on this matter is just appalling.

Many in the USA seem to think that Bush will go down in history as their worst ever President because of his starting an illegal war in Iraq and presiding over torture and illegal imprisonments. History will remember those things for sure - but it will be as the man who did the most to hinder action on climate change that Bush will really be reviled by generations to come.

I don't think anyone would argue that a "green" initiative is unnecessary, if not only out of respect for the world we inhabit. Its not "leftist", its the freakin atmosphere! At least, even if you contest global warming, support the efforts to eliminate flagrant abuses to the worlds natural beauty. Its the responsible thing to do and it encourages community. We need to put politics aside and see the ethical value in worldwide environmentalism. Remember the dodo?