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Old 01-31-2007, 02:36 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Thumbs down Why are so many conservatives set on denying global warming?

Is it so important for the federal government not to intefere with businesses that we should all die or lose our water supply so that businesses don't have to deal with governmental environment regulation?


Welch: Interference in science "stunning" - Boston.com
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Welch: Interference in science "stunning"
January 31, 2007

BURLINGTON, Vt. --U.S. Rep. Peter Welch says it was a "stunning personal experience" to hear federal scientists say they had been stymied from talking about climate change.

"There was a story about a scientist who got authorized to speak at a conference. He was prohibited from using the phrase 'global warming.' He was allowed to say 'global,' and he could say 'warming,' but he couldn't put them next to each other. It became a charade," Welch said.

The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, on which Welch serves, is holding hearings on the administration's handling of the global warming issue. The panel's chairman, Rep. Henry Waxman, D-Calif., said the administration appeared to want "to mislead the public by injecting doubt into the science of global warming."

Welch said he had read about scientists being muzzled, but, "It's a stunning personal experience to hear directly from scientists whose life work has been compromised, who live in fear of retaliation or compromised careers if they adhere to their code of ethics as scientists." The comments came as two advocacy groups -- the Government Accountability Project and the Union of Concerned Scientists -- shared findings with the committee from a survey of about 300 government scientists.

The survey found nearly half the scientists had seen or experienced pressure to delete words like "global warming" from written material.
About 40 percent said thad had seen changes to materials that changed their scientific meanings.

The White House maintains it was trying to bring balance to reports on global warming.

When I read about things like this it makes me feel like I want to see Bush impeached. I don't advocate it, but I think it would be sort of nice in a more ideal world.

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Old 01-31-2007, 03:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Conservs say that those anti-warm people are on the payroll of environmental groups, liberals say that pro-warm people are on the payroll of polluting corporations; so I guess to answer your question--it is all about the money. Just like just about anything in the US.

I really do not know except that I have lime trees and for some reason that want to bloom in January in 40 degree weather--something is up with the climate and I do not think it is good.
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Old 01-31-2007, 03:33 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Conservs say that those anti-warm people are on the payroll of environmental groups, liberals say that pro-warm people are on the payroll of polluting corporations; so I guess to answer your question--it is all about the money. Just like just about anything in the US.

I really do not know except that I have lime trees and for some reason that want to bloom in January in 40 degree weather--something is up with the climate and I do not think it is good.
I have not heard about eg Greenpeace though, that it forced scientists to insert the words "global warming". And if, I would guess every scientist would say, fuck you.

If a government threatens you with the loss of huge fundings in a sublime way, they might have a better argument than environmental groups.



The good thing I can observe is, that slowly the wind is changing in the US. Just a few years you would have been hanged for only mentioning the possible existence of "global warming". Nowadays its already a strongly controversial debate. And the "heads in the sand" diggers loose increasingly ground...
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Old 01-31-2007, 04:02 PM   #4 (permalink)
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The only reason I'm a little skeptical is that not too long ago they were saying we were headed towards a new ice age, and because Mars has had similar temperature increase without the same stimuli as earth. I think that we are definately having an effect though, I'm just not sure if it is as bad as many make out. Like everything else though I'll wait and see before I make a definate opinion about it.
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Old 01-31-2007, 04:25 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Because there's no proof for it.

The only worry I have about "global warming" is coming from Al Bores movie based purely on hot air.

Then Al Bore always HAS been a dangerous source of hot air :-)

There's a reason to fear "global warming". Get THAT moron to shut his lying trap and we'd have nothing to worry about LOL
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Old 01-31-2007, 04:26 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by FRYandBENDER View Post
The only reason I'm a little skeptical is that not too long ago they were saying we were headed towards a new ice age, and because Mars has had similar temperature increase without the same stimuli as earth. I think that we are definately having an effect though, I'm just not sure if it is as bad as many make out. Like everything else though I'll wait and see before I make a definate opinion about it.
Giant Ice Shelf Breaks Free in Arctic; Climate Change Cited as Major Factor

By Rob Gillies
Associated Press
Saturday, December 30, 2006; A18



TORONTO, Dec. 29 -- A giant ice shelf has snapped free from an island south of the North Pole, scientists have said, citing climate change as a "major" reason for the event.

The Ayles Ice Shelf -- all 41 square miles of it -- broke clear 16 months ago from the coast of Ellesmere Island, about 500 miles south of the North Pole in the Canadian Arctic.

Scientists said Thursday that they had discovered the event by using satellite imagery. Within one hour of breaking free, the shelf had formed as a new ice island, leaving a trail of icy boulders floating in its wake.

Warwick Vincent of Laval University in Quebec City, who studies Arctic conditions, said he traveled to the newly formed ice island and couldn't believe what he saw.

"This is a dramatic and disturbing event. It shows that we are losing remarkable features of the Canadian North that have been in place for many thousands of years," Vincent said. "We are crossing climate thresholds, and these may signal the onset of accelerated change ahead."

The ice shelf was one of six major shelves remaining in Canada's Arctic. Packed with ice that is more than 3,000 years old, they float on the sea but are connected to land.

Some scientists say that the shelf's collapse is the largest event of its kind in Canada in 30 years and that climate change was a major factor.

"It is consistent with climate change," Vincent said, adding that the remaining ice shelves are 90 percent smaller than when they were first discovered in 1906. "We aren't able to connect all of the dots . . . but unusually warm temperatures definitely played a major role."

Laurie Weir, who monitors ice conditions for the Canadian Ice Service, was poring over satellite images in 2005 when she noticed that the shelf had split and separated. Weir notified Luke Copland, head of the new global ice lab at the University of Ottawa, who initiated an effort to find out what happened.

Using U.S. and Canadian satellite images, as well as seismic data -- the event registered on earthquake monitors 155 miles away -- Copland discovered that the ice shelf collapsed in the early afternoon of Aug. 13, 2005.
Copland said the speed with which climate change has affected the ice shelves has surprised scientists.

"Even 10 years ago, scientists assumed that when global warming changes occur that it would happen gradually, so that perhaps we expected these ice shelves just to melt away quite slowly," he said.
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Old 01-31-2007, 04:37 PM   #7 (permalink)
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And more Republicans are in agreement with Democrats about Global Warming than you think. Zogby is a non-partisan pollster;

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Old 01-31-2007, 04:39 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Giant Ice shelves have ALWAYS "broken away" from the poles. It's not a new "phenomenon".

This of course is a current, convenient "argument" used a "proof" for Al Bores nonsense.
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Old 01-31-2007, 04:42 PM   #9 (permalink)
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And more Republicans are in agreement with Democrats about Global Warming than you think. Zogby is a non-partisan pollster;

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Like democrats, republican can be wrong too.

And often are.

Both "parties" are full of shit.

That has been proven time and again.

But lets buy into "global warming" simply because THEY say they do (currently).

BTW there IS no scientific consensus on "global warming".
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Old 01-31-2007, 04:50 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I'm pretty 'conservative', though I have to admit that I'm not terribly educated on the matter, so I usually avoid arguing with anyone on it. If anyone knows of a decent website presenting both sides of the argument with sources linked to their thesis and beliefs, I'd be glad to read up on it.
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