One of the big lies the mainstream media have been complicit in promoting is that there is a pro-choice majority in this country. All the opinion polls I have seen in regard to the issue have clearly been carefully and deliberately worded to elicit pro-choice responses.

Interestingly enough, by the standards of these polls, I am "pro-choice" because I believe abortion is justifiable in a very limited number of circumstances, when the fetus will not likely be viable and the woman's physical life is endangered.

If you do some real digging into how Americans feel about abortion, there is little support for abortion on demand. To the contrary, most Americans are morally nervous and have clear reservations about the practice and support some pretty stringent restrictions on it.

The great majority of Americans favor the recent Supreme Court ruling on partioal-borth abortion. The same can be said regarding parents wanting to be informed and involved if their minor daughters become pregnant and are inclined to seek an abortion. I think there is evidence that most feel late-term abortions should be permitted only if there is a clear threat to the life of the mother, and don't approve of permitting abortions because the timing of a pregnancy is inconvenient for the mother for career, educational, or similar reasons.

The left-leaning mainstream media have never been honest or unbiased about this issue. I'm still waiting for someone to take an in-depth approach to research how Americans feel about it. If such a study were done, I'm confident it would validate everything I've said above. But I'm equally certain if such a study were undertaken, it would be ignored into oblivion by the "objective" mainstream press.

Unfortunately the ruling on partial birth abortions only effects such cases as you'd support abortion in. Like when it's either the baby dies or both the mother and baby die. It's an extremely rare procedure. And the justification was along the lines that "the patients won't understand the procedure." That's a terrifying precedent, in case you couldn't tell. Because you know, who the best president is could be too hard for laypeople to understand some day.

Keeping abortion such a hot button issue means there's political motivation to keep up the deception (on both sides); now we're filling up the Court with justices who feel obliged to circumvent Constitutional law for this particular question. In cases like partial birth, the direct effect is minimal yet the damage to the justice system could be serious.

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Funny that you blast polls that show results you do not like and then claim a result with no poll or factual data to back it up!

BTW, there is no such thing as "partial birth abortion". To even use that term is to declare yourself completely void of any knowledge about abortion. Obviously, you prefer reactionary buzz words and empty rhetoric to logical discourse.

Quite simply it does not matter what anyone thinks about abortion other than the woman who is pregnant.

You overstate your case. I don't know all the subtleties of "partial birth abortion" but you seem to just be making an attack on someone who disagrees with you. Even if what you say is true and that partial birth abortion is a misnomer, it does not follow that someone who uses the word is cognizant of whatever nuance you are talking about. It's more than likely that writerman opposes aborting nearly full term fetuses and that's being opposed to a literal "partial birth abortion" regardless of what the actual medical nuances of the procedure are.


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I have already explained "partial birth abortion" (actually, realistically, and more precisely known as D&E (Dilation & Evacuation) procedure) a number of times and would be more than happy to locate the thread if anyone is interested in reading about it. It is not the norm in cases of abortion is mainly done due to medical problems involving the mother, the fetus, or both. Usually it is done once a woman has already decided she wants to continue with her pregnancy but something hinders that. It is a painful procedure that can take place up to two days and it is emotionally taxing for the mother, father, and anyone else close or involved.

People favor the Supreme Court ruling on "partial birth abortion" because they listened to the lie that it is "unnecessary" and were made to believe that women go around waiting until the last minute to decide whether or not they want to continue with their pregnancy and then go to a clinic seven months along to get their baby chopped-up. This is not the reality.

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So what is the technical term for when they partially birth a baby, kill it, then throw it away?

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Neither am I the means to any end others may wish to accomplish. I am not a tool for their use. I am not a servant of their needs. I am not a bandage for their wounds. I am not a sacrifice on their altars. ... I owe nothing to my brothers, nor do I gather debts from them. I ask no one to live for me, nor do I live for others. I covet no mans soul, nor is my soul theirs to covet.

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There is no term since what you describe is not done, but merely the fantasy of the anti choice movement. See Izzabeth's post for the truth about late term abortions.

So a girl's spoken testimony about going to Dr. Tiller's PB abortion clinic is a lie?

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Neither am I the means to any end others may wish to accomplish. I am not a tool for their use. I am not a servant of their needs. I am not a bandage for their wounds. I am not a sacrifice on their altars. ... I owe nothing to my brothers, nor do I gather debts from them. I ask no one to live for me, nor do I live for others. I covet no mans soul, nor is my soul theirs to covet.

Ayn Rand, Anthem.

I'm not saying that it doesn't happen that way. However, it happens a LOT less than people are made to believe. D&E procedures are not the normal procedure and are fairly rare when speaking of abortion practices. They are generally done as a last option on women who would rather be continuing their pregnancy.

Also, from reading some accounts of this Dr. Tiller that you mentioned, it is his practices and his own procedures, not the abortion itself, that has come under fire. Even women who have remained pro-choice but went to the Doctor say that his clinic should be closed due to the way he, himself, operates. Not the abortion itself.

From an anti-Dr. Tiller site:

And again... even then.. many of them express regret at making the decision they made. However, that is a choice that they chose. If they feel regret that is their burden to bear and they had the opportunity to change their minds and they also, now, have an opportunity to come to terms with the decision they made. We make choices in life and most of them we can not take back. That is the real world. The fact that they are unhappy with the decision they made should not effect others.

If Doctor Tiller is a horrendous doctor then his clinic should be closed just as it would be with any other doctor. It should not be closed because he performs late term abortions. From my reading of some of the comments it sounded as if the women were angry with themselves for the decision they made.. but projecting their anger towards the doctor (the first woman says she "wishes she had let her daughter breathe at least one breath of air" instead of having the abortion although her daughter would have died soon after birth due to a defect which would not allow her to live... again... that was a decision she made... if she is unhappy with it now then that is something she has to live with.. her situation is not everyone's situation). Perhaps they have legitimate claims against him. They should be examined. But the late term abortion itself is not the problem.

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