CHUQ

Three things happened last week that signal the swift dynamics of a new world. Last Thursday, at the mausoleum of Imam Khomeini in Qom, south of Tehran, former president and éminence grise of Iranian politics, Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani and the incumbent President, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad pledged unequivocally that the nation would uphold its ‘nuclear rights’ at any cost. They were symbolically together on the occasion of the commencement of festivities of the 28th anniversary of the Islamic revolution in Iran.

On the same day, French President Jacques Chirac, in Paris, let it be known that the hullabaloo about the Iran nuclear issue may, after all, be trite and contrived.

In the Russian capital at the same time, President Vladimir Putin promised to consider an ‘interesting idea’ from Tehran relayed to him over the weekend — to set up an organisation similar to Opec by the world’s gas producing countries.


Carpet geopolitics : HindustanTimes.com


Well sports fans, is a new world approaching?

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Frater M

"Two years from now, hopefully, Israel and the Jewish lobby will not remain the driving force behind Washington’s West Asia policy."

This quote comes from the article you cited, CHUQ, and it made me think, "Whose new world will it be?" As far as AIPAC and the energy barons are concerned, it won't be their new world, at least not entirely. With the development of the 'energy cartel' that may be forming as well as other economic consolidations in Asia, perhaps the best thing for the US to do is aim its attention at our own concerns and how it can proceed with the absolute minimal reliance on other nations. I say let China, India, Pakistan and Russia settle their own territorial, population and energy problems that will soon be upon them. Our priority is our security. If the growing Asian powers haven't learned from the mistakes of the West in politics and industry, it will be to their own detriment, not ours. Maybe the most bothersome outcome will be greater pollution (mmm...smell that Chinese coal burning *cough* night and day *hack*). I have to admit I'm not current with most political activity in Asia, so I'm just shooting from the hip. I realize we just can't magically shift from petroleum based energy to renewable, long-term options overnight. However, we might start seriously working on 'living off the grid,' i.e. finding a solution closer to energy resource isolation than continuing the status quo of playing the game with those who have the oil. Besides, on a more sinister bent, if we allow Asia to burn itself out on petroleum while developing, say Uncle Willie Nelson's Biodiesel (you know, I wonder if that ol' pothead has done any research into hemp oil biofuels...auto exhaust wouldn't be all that bad anymore - 4:20 during the 5:00 rush), we've got plenty of energy to sell them later on. Wow - farmers, consumers and the energy barons all might be winners!

As far as Iran is concerned, who the hell are we to tell them what they can and can't have? Israel is the only state in the region with nukes, so why aren't they under as much scrutiny? I'm sure it's a fact the Israeli government doesn't like making too public. Iran has as many 'nuclear rights' as any other nation. Who will judge the moral qualifications for having such 'rights?' We are still the only nation that has ever utilized a nuke in warfare. We should be the least qualified to judge others. Of course, we do have the knowledge and experience of just what a nuclear war could entail and therefore do have some qualifications in the positive. But we can't say, "You may only have sticks and rocks while we get to keep our machine guns and we'll make sure it stays that way." If we do, how can we ever expect peace or respect from those who, at best, don't trust us much?

Frater M.

Ygorl

It seems the world still beleives that oil is an infinite resource with which we can forever USE to power our very complex, energy dependant societies and economies.


Societies and economies that continue to GROW and NEED more and MORE of it. Oil, that is.

A FINITE resource that will NOT last forever.

Are we making serious effort and looking ahead ? Or will we just let the cards collapse where they will ?


Sure, let Iran have nuclear weapons. They've TOLD the world what they intend to DO with such a weapon if they get it. Let 'em set one off on someone so we (or SOMEONE) can make a glass sheet out of the entire "sandbox" I say.

Frater M

Quoted from Thane:

This wasn't about me, was it? I realize it's limited and was trying to say we need to find some alternatives, no matter the current world situation. Sorry, didn't understand if you were agreeing/disagreeing.

Quoted from Thane:

Israel already has it and has already stated its intentions: nuke Iran!

FOXNews.com - Israeli Military Sources Threaten Tactical Strikes Against Iran - International News | News of the World | Middle East News | Europe News

Quoted from neorealist234:

Might makes right, eh? Looking back at history, I now see that's never caused a problem and has led to more peace, joy and hapiness than any other course of action. Thanks for setting me straight, neo!

FRIENDLY DISCLAIMER: Mr. Frater M. has employed hyperbole and sarcasm to make a point concerning what he feels is a rather silly ideology. Any supposed libel or other attacks are purely just that - supposed and not real. Thank you.

Quote from neorealist234:

Right, not publically. That would be bad for their image as the oppressed, peace-loving nation with highly trained soldiers and civilians with nuclear weapons and the backing of the US who lie bathed in the dark light of tyranny from those evil guys with the Molotov cocktails and old Soviet-era weapons. Oh yeah, and no backing from the "the global superpower." However, with influential nuts like this guy - BBC News | MIDDLE EAST | Rabbi calls for annihilation of Arabs, who's to say it won't be long before it is made public, by word or deed?

Quote from neorealist234:

Not going overboard? Might makes right, doesn't it? How can the ones with the might ever "go overboard" in the first place? Anyone who says or does anything contrary to the notions of the mighty is rightly screwed. From the Alien & Sedition Acts to the Soviet Union, we can see how those who seek to criticize or challenge (as you put it, neo, "balance the other side out") governments encounter the wrath of those who would hold that power unconditionally. However, we also know how the oppressed often harbor the desire to be masters. Take the Christians: peaceful, though defiant and gallantly enduring under discrimination from the Romans. Once they gain the favor and the official sanctioning of their religion from the same, pagan temples and pagans began to disappear. I would think some of the Muslims in the Middle East, if they had the power, would definitely wish to use it against Israel and those who they didn't consider truly Muslim (see: Sunni/Shi'ite conflicts). But do possibilities necessitate action? I can think of a variety of futures my life could take. Should I spend my time preparing for every single one? And do those possibilities justify current oppressions? Paranoia and neurosis and insanity follow quickly on such a path. Yet, paranoia may just be ultimate awareness...meditate upon this, class...OM...


Frater M.

Ygorl

Was just kind of a side topic note. That has to do with this in many ways actually. We are dependant on a lot of middle eastern oil. These people hate our society and our lifestyle. Not to mention that oil won't last forever EITHER. There's going to be problems :-) Big ones.




Yes, and I took note of the date of this writing. Sunday, January 07, 2007. Long after Earths newest form of Hitler, ahmidinejad, called for wiping Israel off the face of the planet. As he builds a nice nuclear program. Just putting 2 and 2 together really.


What ?


Would we expect Israel, instead, to invite him and his countrymen over for tea and crumpets ?

george.d

19% of US imported oil comes from the ME, or 11% of our consumption. Of more importance to the US than the actual oil is retaining USD as the currency exchange for oil to facilitate US debt.

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Ygorl

Yes, there's that too.

That our economy is a house of cards mixed with kind of a shellgame isn't helpfull either.

Even though the ME is NOT the biggest supplier (I'm entirely taking your word for it), lets think about what the price of gas would do if we became unable to GET any supply from the ME. It wouldn't do good for our economy at all.

george.d

The numbers are from Gibson consulting, a respected supplier of energy statistics.

The way I see it current administration had been banking on a US/Israeli attack on Iran as not disturbing Saud or Kuwait production. Prices will greatly escalate due to the futures market, but it'll still be in USD, ensuring US debt facilitation and driving US GDP.

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Ygorl

Yeah, I suppose.

I'm no economist but it seems to me that an economy built on hot air and shuffling things around pays back into reality ONE way or another.

That is what I think we've been avoiding.

By playing shell games and constructing card houses.

I know. Maybe strange seeming analogies but I think they might really apply.

We've avoided paying the piper for so long I don't think paying him off is going to be easy now.

And he WILL be paid.

george.d

Business as usual, until....

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