Stubborn North Korea, Stupid China and Cunning America - Political Forum

Luke · 10-19-2006, 11:34 PM

The Korean Peninsula is a trap, a trap specifically designed for China.

Remember "Six Party Talks"? America made China to be the "leading role", and used the words "Stake Holder" to attract Chinese into the trap.

For two years, Six Party Talks have no fruit, which is not strange due to no bilateral talks between America and North Korea. Therefore, American threatened to quit to embarass China. China alone cannot make peace between America and North Korea.

China was worried and pressured North Korea, thus the "Provisional Declaration" came out. However, when the cunning Americans' were signing the contracts with their right hands, their left hands were already holding a huge "weapon". Just after signing the contract with ink still wet, the American sanctions come!

At this time, America had everything ready. Because North Korea counterfeited American dollars, America gave harsh sanctions to North Korea. However, from North Korea's perspective, although they counterfeited money, they had done that for many years, and America knows it. Now, America specifically chose this time to give sanctions, which was intentionally agitating North Korea.

Then, Six Party Talks broke. America insisted on talks, but gave sanctions at the same time. North Korea refused to talk without lifting the sanctions. China has been tragically trapped by American's "stake holder" responsibilities.

After the nuclear test, with UN sanctions, Conderizza Rice comes to Beijing and wants China to be the frontline to deal with North Korea, while America hides behind. If China agrees to be harsh to North Korea, the Bush administration will use this as Diplomatic Success for the November election to neutralize the negative influence from Iraq. If China is still soft, they can easily blame China to American voters.

If America can push China and South Korea to stop all the food aid, Kim's regime would collapse. A unified pro-America Korean peninsula will send American soldiers directly to the Chinese border.

Luke · 10-21-2006, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.B. Du Bois

The fact of the matter is that the US' policy of Korean isolation has been in place for decades, and I don't think that any additional sanctions have been that major. It is China who really holds the influence over North Korea and North Korea did not do what you publicly asked them to do. The reason that they did so is because CHINESE POLICY ON NORTH KOREA IS UNCLEAR. It is ambivalent. You don't really know WHAT you want them to do, and that is why they don't know if you are serious or not when you tell them to stop. When China tells North Korea to stop testing nukes or missiles, I think a lot of people are skeptical that China really means what it says. What is China's REAL interest and REAL strategy for North Korea? Does your country even have one? Do you have one that you'd like to see?

WEB

I think the new financial sanction came last year before North Korea quited the talks. North Korea quited the talks last year mainly due to that sanction.

Most of the Chinese view North Korea as a completely foreign country. As long as it has no major impact on China, people don't think China has the right to pressure North Korea. They think North Korea's problem is always between North Korea and America. Being not a Chinese problem, that is partly why China's policy is more or less ambivalent. If China directly pushes North Korea, it is interfering their domestic business. China is reluctant in taking any "global responsibilities" that America always takes.

Luke · 10-22-2006, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.B. Du Bois

OK, for the sake of argument, let's say that this is true. So are you saying that Americans have no right to stop trading with a country that counterfeits our money and sells drugs?
This attitude is exactly what has helped NK to get the bomb.
OK then, don't take any responsibilities. Guess you don't mind if Japan, South Korea, Indonesia, Vietnam and every single one of China's neighbors gets nuclear weapons then, eh?

The thing is that China does not feel endangered by North Korea's nuclear program. So, the motivations is low. It is a more cultural thing that China is reluctant to control other countries.

francois60 · 10-23-2006, 05:18 PM

China is the only nation with leverage with North Korea. Now, if China is okay with a nuclear North Korea they should come out and say so. Since China says in public that they consider a nuclear North Korea to be unacceptable, then either you are incorrect or your government is lying.

The 1994 Agreed Framework failed because the US has no leverage to enforce any agreements with North Korea. We cut out China. That's why we resist bilateral talks in 2006. Bilateral talks can only lead to another agreement that isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

Luke · 10-24-2006, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by W.E.B. Du Bois

China recently sent a diplomat to Korea and told North Korea to not test another nuclear bomb. You can be that China threatened to cut North Korea off from food and fuel if North Korea confused. So China obviously does feel endangered by North Korea's nuclear program.

That just shows that China is pressured by America, and China would like to do a favor in this situation. Even if North Korea poses a danger to China, it is an indirect danger.

Quote:

Sorry, but I don't buy that for one second. It's not a cultural thing at all. That is Chinese propaganda. It is a geopolitical thing. China has SAID that it does not want to interfere with the inner workings of other countries because China is AFRAID that other people will interfere with the inner workings of China. The CCP is primarily concerned with staying with power, and the CCP is constantly under criticism for Tiananmen Square, the invasion of Tibet, the persecution of the Falun Gong and for curtailing Chinese political freedoms. This line of non-interference is merely a shield from criticism and possible sanctions over the heavy-handed actions of the CCP.

What you say is correct! I only mean part of the reason is cultural.

Luke · 10-24-2006, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by francois60

China is the only nation with leverage with North Korea. Now, if China is okay with a nuclear North Korea they should come out and say so. Since China says in public that they consider a nuclear North Korea to be unacceptable, then either you are incorrect or your government is lying.

Those are diplomatic languages. I think it is more like China thinks NK's nuclear program is not a good sign, but is not intolerable. Due to all diplomatic considerations, China still supports the non-nuclear Korea peninsula.