pug_ster

This number is only a gage of how it determines this, as all the democratic countries tend to be on the top while the communist or dictatorship countries tend to be on the bottom. Both Chinese and Western Media are biased, so I can't believe every word they said anyways. Like I said, the problem with Chinese Media is usually not what they tell you, the problem is usually what they don't tell you.

anya

My goodness how you twist things to suit whatever argument you want to present.

I found this on the site;

“Unfortunately nothing has changed in the countries that are the worst predators of press freedom,” the organisation said, “and journalists in North Korea, Eritrea, Turkmenistan, Cuba, Burma and China are still risking their life or imprisonment for trying to keep us informed. These situations are extremely serious and it is urgent that leaders of these countries accept criticism and stop routinely cracking down on the media so harshly.'

chaochao

of course media in china don't be clear and free now, i admit that, but it is more and more free than before, that is true, however it is not practical to be absolute free! Western meida are keen and skilled at spreading their political ideas with the intention of instigation, they are a kind of weapon in the invisible war between china and western countries.

__________________
借我三千虎贲，复我浩荡中华! 汉旗指处，望尘逃遁！敢犯我中华天威者，虽远必诛!

anya

I really don't think you are right there chaochao. There is no invisible war between us and China, certainly not on our sides.

Why do you think that freedom of the press would be so wrong for China? It is so hard for me to understand why anyone would not want to know what is going on.

pug_ster

You keep wanting me to go back to divert attention on Chinese Media deficiencies. I did say that alot of Chinese don't believe what they read in Chinese media, right? What part of it you don't understand? Does that mean that they should trust more in Western Media? No. Ever since this whole Olympics fiasco, I would not swallow what they said.

chaochao

of course there is war, US has already sent troops to many countries to fight, no one can say they won't send troops to china!
As for myself, I don't oppose freedom of media, but if your ever read a book "Ugly Chinese" by a chinese author and chinese history and its civil war since acient time, you will understand the chinese nation's bad weaknesses, but i think it is hard for foreingers to understand.
Free media would be utilized by some people with evil intention of cheating and stirring people to cast down gov ( of course i admit our gov often cheat via media), the destroy of current CCP gov will involve china into separation and war and so many problems. We would rather want stability and economic growth than the prate and slogan of free media!

__________________
借我三千虎贲，复我浩荡中华! 汉旗指处，望尘逃遁！敢犯我中华天威者，虽远必诛!

pug_ster

Invisible war? If there is no invisible war why does US, UK, France, Germany, etc... complaining of 'human rights' issues in China and want to shove Dalai Lama (religion) into China.

So what does freedom of the press will do for China? Does it help raising the living standards in China? Does it help with the social aspects of China? The only thing that the freedom of the press is create more dissention and destabilize China.

anya

It has never entered my mind that the US would go to war with China. It would not happen. Do you not have nuclear bombs? Totally impossible.

Wars are usually fought for economic reasons. I was listening to news 24 early one morning and they were saying that the US is at the moment financially dependent on China. They said China was keeping the US afloat. The US government is really only concerned about money. It has no interest in things like civil liberties and so on which us ordinary people are interested in.

I simply cannot imagine a war with China unless something completely unimaginable at the moment happened.
No I have only just heard of the book. Chinese people must have changed a lot through the years. We are quite different to people who lived 100 years ago.

Why would wanting to change the government mean that people had an evil intention? I'm sure I've heard Chinese people here often talking about the time when the government will change. I see your point though that you would need some kind of changes so that people had a way to express things and change without people suddenly trying a coup!! But you know that would not happen. China seems to have very good control, so yes, I think it might lead to this, if the people decided they wanted government change and something else became available, but I think it would be gradual change, or certainly could be gradual change. I think it is going to happen sometime.

I hear what you are saying and I think that the wars you are talking about are with various different sections of China. You have 1/4 of the world's population. That is a heck of a lot of people for one government to take care of. You will only have problems if people feel they are not being treated correctly. It is of course perfectly possible to do change peacefully. This has happened many times and is a far better option.
Of course it depends on what media you expose yourself to. Some is rubbish as you say, other is absolutely excellent. It is about information. It is about knowing what is going on...but I think probably a free media is impossible when you are run under an authoritarian regime...not because 'evil' people will stir (though of course I am not denying that gangsters could do that) but far more because as people begin to get information and understand what is going on, they will want change. It is obvious. At the moment you have no choice. Knowledge and freedom to speak gives you choice and responsibility.

I understand on the one hand people being afraid of trying for change because they have seen what happens when people try it in the past. I do understand that fear and that with everything becoming better economically it feels easier just to let things be.

I do though worry for the people who are not enjoying the increase in prosperity. I think possibility they would like the ability to speak. Also economics go up and down, you cannot rely on them staying good...and you cannot forever force people to stay with you if they do not want to.

smallpox

You don't get it, democracy IS the way to sustainable economic growth and to fix social problems. Authoritarianism can do it faster in the short run but runs out of breath in the long run. Reasons are simple; authoritarianism does not encourage critical thinking -- thus innovation. An authoritarian state is one that lives a step behind the innovations of free societies. China, South Korea, Japan, Germany, they all did nothing more than what foreign companies told them to manufacture or copying what foreign companies were making and selling it at a lower price when critical thinking was lacking in the government form. If you want China to have an economy that benefits some but disadvantages the same amount, that lives off cheap labour, that's always a step behind everyone...then call for authoritarianism. Second, the centralized authority just sees one thing; the greater picture of economic growth -- it does not preoccupy them much how many peasants and fisherman lose their water supplies, land and thus living, because they're in God knows where, can't really voice their opinions, can't vote against it, and the state is unaccountable for its action. Subsequently you have whole villages devastated for a few factories.
If only there was some way to determine if the new factory in the village would end up benefiting most, or harming most.......ah yes! vote on it. It won't mean a civil war, it'll just let people make the most rational decision for themselves. They know better than anyone else in Beijing.
Why is there so much opposition to such a sensible solution? I say national pride against whatever is perceived to be "western".

pug_ster

One mans freedom fighter is another man's terrorist as they always say. It does not matter if the person is holding a gun or a pen. If you spread the ideas that does not agree with the stance of the government and start to protest about it, you will be heckled out in Western Media, or in China's case, you might be jailed. In any case, the voice of the minority will not be heard in both cases.