Locke9-05

What? No, no, no... You said: "Your arguments so far haven't been well made," which is opinionated and insulting (that's a fair warning to you as to how you phrase such opinionated statements in the future). That means it's your individual opinion, despite that it was phrased as if it was ultimate "fact." That's the subjectivity we're talking about... It seems as if you completely lost track of what that side-argument was even about, but I could be wrong...
Oh, right... Perhaps you'd like to provide us with some actual research to back that statement? No? Until you do, that statement is nothing but your individual opinion--which holds essentially no water against the articles and research that you're criticizing... Unless you can post some qualified source that shows "fetal psychology" to be "meaningless play," then the only thing that's meaningless play is your completely unbacked criticism of something that's supported with research.
Perhaps it isn't clear as to just how illogical that "counter-argument" really is. Allow me to explain for the umpteenth time. This is a completely ridiculous "argument:"

People will do these things no matter whether they're illegal or not, so society should just stop enforcing them

Why is this a completely ridiculous argument? Because it's purely anarchical--it goes against the very grain of society. Yes, people will always do stupid things, people will always do things that are immoral, illogical, and against the fabric of common sense, but does that mean that they shouldn't face consequences for their actions? Hah! On the contrary. Society can't roll over and let criminals and immoral lunatics walk all over it just because "people will do these things no matter what." That same asinine argument could be used for literally any crime or stupid behavior.

There will always be people who murder, no matter whether it's legal or not, so why does society enforce those laws?

There will always be people who steal, no matter whether it's illegal or not--despite that it's illogical and cruel, so society shouldn't keep enforcing it. People have always stolen.

There will always be people who speed in motor vehicles, endangering those around them, no matter whether it's illegal or not, so society shouldn't keep enforcing those mandates.

"History" (according to the flawed "logic" you presented) reduces all the arguments against those things, because people have and always will continue to do them... So does that mean that they should just keep getting away with stupid, illogical and harmful behavior? Hell no. Should mothers be able to murder human beings they created for purely selfish reasons because of their own damn irresponsibility? Hell no.
Perhaps you'd like to familiarize yourself with such terms before so hastily throwing them out there. There was no "guilt by association" fallacy here, none of my arguments even fit that description. In fact, I find it incredibly laughable that you'd even throw out such a term--apparently without having a true understanding of it:

Association fallacy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


did I ever "blame" or "guilt" anything by associating it with other things? No... I was using examples and applying the logic you presented to me to other very versatile situations/scenarios within this society.

You still think I'm trying to actually link abortion with drug dealing and other illegalities? I already told you otherwise and if you continue to misrepresent others' arguments, you're going to find yourself in a not-so pleasant situation. We don't take kindly to straw man arguments here. I'm showing how the flawed logic you presented in this topic (the "people will always do it, so why does society even bother punishing them?" logic) can go along with any scenario of irresponsible, illogical, immoral, and stupid behavior, and that in no way is it a good "defense" of abortion or any of the other situations/scenarios. Just because "people will continue to do something" illogical and irresponsible doesn't mean they shouldn't face the consequences for doing it. That flawed and fallacious "logic" could be used to defend any stupid and irresponsible person from facing the consequences of their actions.

That's the point I was making. Making it illegal--the way it was and should still be--will make people face the consequences for their irresponsible and stupid behavior. I would expect no less for anyone, even myself. People who do stupid, immoral, and irresponsible things in society are punished. Just because "people will always do stupid, immoral and irresponsible things in society" sure as hell doesn't mean society should stop enforcing the consequences for the stupidity, immorality and irresponsibility.

Don't post two-word one-liners and there won't be a problem with interpretation... When you write "I see" in response to a paragraph or so, there are literally hundreds of possible interpretations for that. One-liners are pointless and hard to understand/interpret, so there's no way to call me out for "reading comprehension," when it's practically impossible to interpret such a cryptic one-liner response--therefore lack of specificity and clarification in the response/reply is what the issue really was.
This is a moral issue, there's no "imagining" to it. Society has morals, the idea that society doesn't have a moral code is just incorrect. Society debates and struggles with moral issues every day. I'm ideologically conservative, but I'm not a religious fundamentalist, nor am I a "right wing religious conservative." I simply recognize that it's appalling to kill any human being, no matter how big small, young or old for selfish irresponsible reasons. That's a moral issue, and the moral answer to the issue is a pretty obvious one. Don't murder human beings for selfish reasons--find humane and natural alternatives like adoption.
By society's own standards I retain my moral integrity in this regard--I haven't murdered any human being or any creature for any reason--let alone to make my life "simpler" or for some other dumb selfish reason like that. That's as much of an answer to that stupid question as you're going to get. That question--directed very pointedly and personally--was irrelevant and ridiculous to the actual material of this topic. Don't ever ask me a question like that again.
Ironic that most pro-choice individuals are so opposed to killing on the front of battle, calling conservatives killers and "war-mongers," but when it comes to slaughtering thousands of innocent human beings from within the womb for completely selfish and irresponsible reasons, oh--that's just fine.

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"Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country."
-John F. Kennedy

"Education begins the gentleman, but reading, good company and reflection must finish him."
-John Locke

"What worries you, masters you."
-John Locke
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